Acetyl-glutathione

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia and ME & Chronic Fatigue Syndrome' started by Elisa, Jan 8, 2013.

  1. Elisa

    Elisa Member

    Hi All,

    Have read quite a bit about this new form of glutathione - acetyl-glutathione...

    Anyone have experience with it? Pros and cons.

    Just thought I throw it out there - one person on Phoenix Rising gained a ton of energy from it - going from 300 mgs to about 1800 throughout the day. Here is the person's quote:


    "I've had great results taking s-acetyl glutathione per a recommendation in a recent presentation by Dietrich Klinghardt. I knew when I started your protocol having a glutathione source was paramount, but I hesitated at the cost of this - $100 for 60 100 mg caps from Allergy Research. And then I got too sick to even remember what was going on. Toxicity, who me? Heavy metals? I was too confused to realize what hit me. Fortunately, a friend who is familiar with the SMP stepped in.

    I started doing DMSA in August, about 6 weeks after starting the protocol. That was a big help. But what really cleared my brain in 45 minutes flat was the s-acetyl glutathione. It lifted my mood, gave me energy, and made for a beautiful day. I have been much, much, much better ever since, and am now getting ready to go back to work.

    Nature Doc has a much better priced product than ARG at $75 for 60 caps at 300 mg. Service was extremely courteous and shipping was fast and free. You can read about it here: www (dot) naturedoc (dot) com/products/acetyl-glutathione.html. The main differentiator from other forms of glutathione is it remains whole until it gets in your cell, where it is de-acetylized. This leaves the glutathione molecule available in it's entirety. So no breaking it down and reassembling the fragments. It may even be more effective than an IV push - and at a fraction of the cost.

    I started out with 2 caps, and then took up to 6 a day which made me feel great. After a couple weeks, I took 10 days off and just did NAC 2-2.5g/day. Now I'm back on the glutathione at a lower dose of 2 caps (600 mg/day). So if my monthly cost is $75 per bottle of 60 for 18 g, that's cheaper than my doctor's ~1800 mg IV, for 10X the GSH, at my convenience."

    Anyway - thought it was interesting...


    Thanks & God Bless,

    Elisabeth


    [This Message was Edited on 01/09/2013]
  2. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    My L.A. integrative medicine doctor recommended acetyl-glutathione for me. He wanted me to take 2 capsules a day, but the stuff he sold was $100 a bottle (!), way too much. I eventually found Nutricology brand on-line for $50 a bottle for 60 - 100 mg. caps. I took 2 a day for awhile, and then cut back to 1 a day. It's just so pricey on top of everything else I take.

    Now, did it help me? I probably took it for about 4 months. I don't know if it helped. I do know I now tolerate gelatin (which is high in glycine which helps calm the brain, plus helps detoxing) and taurine without bad side effects. Before they used to hit me like a truck, the detox was pretty bad. I don't know if the AG is why, it may be part of it. I'm also dong qigong exercises, they may be helping too. But something is working better.

    Unfortunately, I still crash, my stamina is still quite limited. I'm hoping if I can detox more, my stamina may increase. Have been fighting a bug for several weeks, finally getting over it, and then hope to resume detoxing - yay! (I hate it, the story of my life - detox, detox detox), but truthfully am very curious to see if I do tolerate it better. There's an HCL detox protocol that I am going back on in a day or two.

    How's that for an answer! The AG may help, my muscle testing says it did help.

    I just looked at your post more carefully - 60 - 300 mg. capsules is a very good deal compared to the other 100 mg. products. I called and found that the brand they sell is Maplewood. I'll probably order a bottle of this just to try it. $75 is a lot of money, but if it's helping to really make a difference, is worth it.

    I'm glad you did this post!

    Mary
  3. elliespad

    elliespad Member

    Elisa, YEARS ago, I did IV Glutathione. Maybe 10 or 20 times. I never had an increase in energy, endurance, strength, clearheadedness, nothing. BUT,,, it completely got rid of my Chemical Sensitivities. I was never expecting that, but was certainly welcomed.

    Also, I've taken Glutathione precursors. N-Acetyl-Cysteine, ImmunePro, Alpha Lipoic Acid, and had HUGE, unbearable detox symptoms. Also, I did Rich VanKs, Methylation Protocol, back in '07 (?)again, getting SO sick from severe detox that I've never had the nerve to try it again.

    Until now. I went ahead and ordered the Acetyl-Glutathione from Nature Doc. Seems to be the best price around. Will let you know how it goes.

    Thanks,
    elliespad
  4. Elisa

    Elisa Member

    Thank you to you both for replying...you've inspired me to try the acetyl-glutathione also. The person I quoted above had such a positive experience that it really deserves some experimentation.

    I have lots of sensitivities/allergies - right now swelling and peeling eyelids - for months - ughh.

    I remember reading about the MCS specialist - Dr. Grace Ziem - and how she uses glutathione in different forms to help those with MCS. I wonder what she thinks of this new form of oral glutathione - that is supposed to be more available to the body.

    So please post with any news - I'd love to hear - and thank you so much again for posting on this topic!!!!

    God Bless,

    Elisabeth
  5. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    S-acetyl-glutathione is used in cancer therapy BUT the result is the opposite of what you might expect. It decreases intracellular glutathione. This is why it is used in cancer therapy. In cancer therapy the level of anti-oxidants must be reduced not increased. This induces apoptosis or cell death of the tumor cells.

    Remember that anti-oxidants are preventatives whereas they must be blocked for cell death.

    However I do not know anything about its use in ME/CFS and weird things do happen so I don't want to put a damper on your trials. I will follow this with interest.
  6. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    I went to the nature doc website and their blurb about acetyl-l-glutathione says it actually increases cellular glutathione. It does talk about its use in cancer treatment, as well as several other illnesses, including FM, and CFS/ME.

    One interesting fact they state is that if you have heavy metal toxicity, it can prevent you from producing glutathione because it displaces magnesium. It's a very interesting little blurb.

    Mary
  7. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    OK. But I have seen no scientific literature on s-acetyl-glutathione showing an increase in intracellular GSH except for one invitro study showing it increased GSH in fibroblast cells. But in vivo studies have shown that the apoptosis occuring in cancer cells is due to significantly reduced GSH. What may have happened here is that the early studies, like one done on mice cells (in vitro) showed an increase in GSH where there was a genetic fault in the GSH reductase gene. Now, can we really extend this to human cells in vivo? If these claims by naturopaths and supplement sellers are correct it should show up in a scientific paper soon. I will keep my eye open. Problem is also, how much does it increase intra-cellular glutathione and how did they measure it. A very tricky thing to measure in vivo.

    It would be great if is is confirmed especially for those people who cannot tolerate NAC.
    [This Message was Edited on 01/12/2013]
  8. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    Here's a link: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11743644

    From my reading of this, it does state (as you do above), that SAG induces apoptosis in certain cancer cells and this is due to the reduction of GSH in the cancer cells by the SAG.

    But, the article goes on to state that SAG did NOT induce GSH depletion in normal lymphocytes. In other words, it would appear that SAG behaves differently with cancer cells than with normal cells, at least in this one study.

    This could explain why SAG could increase GSH in normal cells, and thus be of benefit to FM and CFS/ME and other patients, and yet still kill cancer cells by GSH depletion.

    Mary
  9. Forebearance

    Forebearance Member

    Thanks for posting this, Elisabeth!

    It sounds really good and I'd like to try it as soon as I can afford it, but I have had strong bad reactions to NAC and alpha lipoid acid, so I will be very careful.

    Forebearance
  10. Elisa

    Elisa Member

    Interesting thread!

    Thanks so much for the great research Mary!!!!

    So good to hear from you Forebearance - you are so encouraging - thanks!!!!

    I hope to order some soon too - I really pray for something to have some positive impact!

    God Bless,

    Elisabeth
  11. neoplus1

    neoplus1 Member

    I think the Methylation Protocol should be the way to go. Not to mention certain dietary changes can support production of Glutathione.

    Exercise can increase levels but that is an issue for most of us until we can reach a certain level of recovery.

    Undenatured Whey Protein and NAC are good ways. I haven't heard much from people with regards to Undenatured Whey. Has it fallen out of favor?

    This does sound interesting though.

    -Steve
  12. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    Keep us posted if you try this - I'm really glad you started this thread!

    Best wishes,

    Mary
  13. elliespad

    elliespad Member

    Took my first dose this morning.

    Will let you know.
  14. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    at increasing intracellular GSH then what symptoms would you expect it to have a noticeable effect on and over what time period?
  15. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    I have no idea how ACG may actually work, what symptoms it would cause to abate. I do know that Richvank stressed over and over and over again that he believed CFS symptoms were due to glutathione depletion and his methylation protocol was designed to increase methyhlation and glutathione. And many of us could not tolerate his protocol for various reasons. I tihnk a lot of it was due to potassium depletion caused by increased methylation, which went undiagnosed. But it also caused a lot of detoxing, just hard to say.

    Anyways, AcG is supposed to increase intrcellular glutathione and how quickly it would work and what hte actual effects are, I just don't know. It all depends on dosage I would think and how we are all so different.

    I am tolerating detoxing much better than before after taking ACG. I don't know if this is due to the ACG or other factors. I've also been doing qigong exercises for 2 months - they may be a factor too.

    But if you read Rich's posts, you'll find why he believed glutathione was so important. Only it seems so difficult to raise levels, and ACG may be one means of doing so.

    If you go to the nature doc website (I know, it's not a scientific paper), but anyways, it says that even with NAC some people still had difficulty synthesizing glutathione due to heavy metal toxiciety or magnesium deficiency. So ACG may be one way around this block. It says glutathione is very important for energy production and mitochondrial function among many other things. Glutathione is also very important for proper detoxing.

    We are guinea pigs here. There is no one telling us what to do (apart from Rich who is sorely missed). We experiement and read what has helped someone else, and try that, and do it over and over again.

    Look at the first post in this thread, you'll read about someone who was helped a great deal by taking ACG, in rather larger doses than I did. And I've almost talked myself back into shelling out more money for this. I wish the things that truly help us weren't so expensive! But c'est la vie -

    Mary
  16. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    Actually I have read Rich's posts and even talked with him about the protocol which he adapted from the autism protocol.

    I think he was onto something and worked very hard at detailing it but I do not agree that CFS is a glutathione depletion. I know it involves GSH depletion in some people with CFS but not all by any means. GSH depletion is common in neuro-immune diseases such as Parkinsons, MS, SLE and autism and even schizophrenia.

    That just tells us it is a consequence of mitochondrial dysfunction caused by immunological dysfunction, probably elevated IFN-g and IFN-a as well as cytokine IL-10 and in the early stages of CFS/ME by RNase-L.

    So my position is that I do not think an all-out drive to increase GSH will help that much. It will help, but not that much.

    I am lucky that I can take NAC + other mitochondrial support and it has helped me tremendously but I do not put that down to increased GSH. I put it down to improved mitochondrial function. However I have done many things:

    reduced exposure to toxins in my food and the air.
    take a selection of probiotics.
    take high levels of vitD as well as get as much sun as possible
    changed my diet considerably
    Do all i can to avoid psychological stresses
    Maximise my sleep

    I do not believe that pursuing one or other drug or supplement will help substantially.

    I am a "retired" consultant but I advise a number of colleagues on this illness and, in short my protocol is this:

    adjust lifestyle to the illness
    modify diet ( reduce sugar and sat fats, increase omega 3)
    maximize sleep
    adopt the mitochondrial myopathy protocol as able (this includes the methylation cycle replenishment)
    engage in daily exercise as appropriate (very important)
    increase vitamin D levels to allow safe high exposure to sun or UVB lamp.
    avoid exposure to environmental toxins as much as possible
    avoid or learn to deal with psychological stress
  17. Elisa

    Elisa Member

    Hi All,

    When I was a patient of Dr. Cheney's it really impacted me that he believed that if we could get glutathione up high enough it would knock out any and all infections and we would improve. His pressed hard on us/me taking undenatured whey (that was first tauted as a cure for AIDS years ago) so that I could benefit from the resulting glutathione increase.

    I think I will order it today - it just feels right...

    God Bless,

    Elisabeth

  18. elliespad

    elliespad Member

    First, my initial order from NatureDoc, never came. USPS tracking says it was last in Texas on Jan 10. So, I asked NatureDoc for a refund, which they readily agreed to. AND, CollegePharmacyStore has the same product for $49.95, plus $10.95, so I ordered from them and received it the following day.

    I took one capsule per day for two days, yesterday (Sunday) being day 2. By mid afternoon I had EXTREME stomach pain or reflux. I do not normally have any problems like that, and I frequently eat VERY spicy Thai and Indian food, 2 or 3 times a week, so what this was I don't know. It was EXTREMELY painful, and I took multiple doses of baking soda in water, and it never helped. It was nearly unbearable painand it seemed to be cause by being physically compressed from sitting, as it was completely fine when I went to bed and reclined. I was fine all night and woke much improved today. I did not take another dose today, instead waiting for this to completely resolve before trying this again.

    I get similar, extreme stomach pain from the prescription Cortef, a commercial Hydrocortisone. I have to get that script compounded and have no problem with that. I don't know if this was caused by the Glutathione supplement or not. Time will tell. Will let you know.
  19. mbofov

    mbofov Member

    Do keep us posted. That's a little scary, I hope it wasn't the ACG which caused the problem.

    I checked and it looks like the ACG you got from College Pharmacy Store was the 100 mg. dose, not the 300 mg. dose which Nature Doc has, which would explain the cheaper price.

    I have bought the Nutricology brand ACG (100 mg., 60 caps) on-line for $50 with free shipping. If you google you can find it pretty easily.

    I do want to the try the kind from Nature Doc because it is 300 mg., 60 caps for $75.00.

    Let us know how it goes -

    Mary
  20. Elisa

    Elisa Member

    I have delayed trying the acetyl-glutathione until I get over my bug (cold) and also am waiting to hear if Ellispad is better.

    Please let us now - how you are doing...

    God Bless,

    Elisabeth