Barrowinnovations, Dr Farr Patients, Need Advice????

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by llelnino, Nov 13, 2008.

  1. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    I just have some questions regarding Dr Farr and was wondering if you could help. I am trying to decide whether Dr Farr would be able to help me with my situation. I first came down with CFS in 12/06 from a flulike illness that was a sudden onset. My appetite is horrible and I have lost 30 pounds and counting. Does he only treat and supplement stomach/liver issues or does he look into other areas such as hormones(cortisol,dhea,thyroid)

    Is he familiar with the Methylation Clycle? Does he offer testing/treatment for this or would I have to follow the treatment protocol from this board? Does he look into any other issues? overall is he knowledgeable about CFS in regards to treatment?

    Who else here has seen or is being seen by Dr Farr? Any progress? Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

  2. Catseye

    Catseye Member

    Hi Mike,

    Dr. Farr has looked at all my standard hormones including cortisol, dhea and thyroid. The tests I've done are stool tests, hpa axis test, lyme tests, comprehensive bloodwork and a heavy metals test. I don't know if or how much he is familiar with the methylation cycle itself. He's more into fixing the underlying problem rather than individual metabolic problems. I can see that the treatment for the gut is resolving the other metabolic problems in my case. He is very knowledgeable about the liver and I have pretty much stopped taking my folate. I feel so good during the day, I just forget all about it. So I guess I don't need it anymore. He said he has treated hundreds of CFSers and seems to be confident in his ability to treat it. It is difficult because we all have different test results, but I've had great results with him. It's taking a long time, but it's a steady, gradual improvement.

    Before I did any of the tests, I had to fill out lengthy questionnaires, several of them, about various organs and symptoms. It was a couple hundred questions or so, not sure exactly how many, and it took me 2 days to complete it. Then he reviewed it and decided what tests I needed. You can fill out a brief quiz on his site and get a free phone consultation. Then you can tell him what's wrong and he can tell you if he thinks he can help. I've done much better with his treatment than with the methylation protocol. I didn't do the full meth protocol, just the few supps like folate, intrinsic B12, RNA, the multi and phosphatidyl serine. They helped a lot, but nothing really worked to completely relieve my worst symptoms because I was eating the wrong things and too many carbs. Once the gut is damaged (imbalance of flora and hyperpermeability of gut lining), it has to be fixed or it will prevent everything else from working properly - it is the heart of digestion as well as the immune system.

    You don't just tell him you have CFS and he tells you what to do. He is very precise about symptoms and test results and he says no two people are alike. You get a tailor made plan just for you based on scientific test results which is exactly what we need. I am in contact with a couple of other people using him and we have exchanged results and they are all different. And so we all have different diets, different supplements (but some of the same) and have even done different tests.

    One of the first things that happened in a couple of weeks after starting my new diet and supps was that my own appetite turned into a raging tiger and I ate big meals for once and felt like I was finally digesting the meals and getting something out of them. I didn't feel "too full" after eating and didn't congest my liver. I was having real problems eating fats and proteins before this. I went on like that - gorging myself - for a couple of months before it quieted down some. Then I started eating just enough so I wasn't hungry and I was able to gain weight easily. All of my worst symptoms have gradually gone away to almost nothing. I still have issues with fatigue if I push it, and my thyroid hormones are still a bit low, but I'm so much better than I was. Brain function and everything has improved. I still have some permanent damage to my liver from before to contend with, and I think I developed some kidney damage, too, but I don't think they're bad enough to keep me disabled forever. I'll get over this at some point.

    Once he told me that by the time people come to him, they're usually on their last legs. He's very easy to talk to and is not arrogant and pushy, like trying to sell you things you don't need. At least you've only been bad a couple of years, it took me 5 years to find this guy. If I had gone to him when I first got sick, I'm sure I'd be over it by now and it never would have gotten as severe as it did which made me want to end it all to stop the agony. But one thing about the agony, it gave me willpower of steel to follow the highly restricted diet. I won't take a chance on feeling like that ever again - it was real torture. I'll do anything to get as far away from that as I can, including giving up everything I used to like to eat. If you can stick to the diet, you can improve. Don't tempt yourself, mute those ads for Dairy Queen and other crappy foods! You may have to give up all wheat and dairy, but there are adequate substitutes like gluten free foods (if you are allowed any grains at all) and nut milks if you absolutely have to have a glass of milk. You can Y! me if you want to know more.

    good luck!
  3. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    Hi Mike,

    I just got my tests results back from Dr. Farr and had an hour consultation with him. I won't go in to all the details of the tests as they are the same that Karen had.

    I have never ever talked with a doctor that is so knowing and caring as Dr. Farr. He is first working on the digestive inflammation, Candida-fungal/yeast infections, vit D deficiency and iodine deficiency and lack of stomach acids. He estimates the treatment time will be about 8 weeks. Then step 2 will be the Lyme- the lab diagnosed this after having it for 18 years! and then the blood panel and the problems there - hormones, cortisol and the thyroid and the rest of the mess LOL

    Like Karen said you can take the comprehensive tests for free then have a consultation, again free, with Dr. Farr and decide if you want him to help you
    It won't cost anything and there is nothing to lose. I can't say enough good about Dr. Farr.

    I only wish I had heard about him years ago. I would have saved thousands of dollars in trying to self diagnose and I would not have gone years being so ill - the worse has been these past 18.

    I just read your profile and saw you have been tested for Lyme. The lab that Dr. Farr uses - Central Florida Research, Inc- uses a completely different testing method than those other labs. This test is very accurate with no false positive or false negatives. Dr. Farr can explain it or you can go to their website and check it out.

    I start my supplements next Tuesday but I have already started the diet, it is strict and am looking at it like a diabetic would - life or death sort of thing. One of the bacteria I have is Klebsiella and thrives on carbs, so if I can starve those suckers to death I will!


    [This Message was Edited on 11/13/2008]
    [This Message was Edited on 11/13/2008]
  4. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    Thank you so much for responding to me. I actually did the free consultation with him last week but I forgot to ask him some of these things. He does seem like he really knows his stuff but I have been swaying back and forth as to who I should go see. I went to a Wellness/Nutritionist over the summer that did some of the things that Dr Farr does.

    She did a DNA stool test(metametrix labs) the only thing that was found was slight dybiosis, whatever that means exactly she also did a saliva test where she said that my cortisol was very low, she also did a hair mineral analysis(trace elements) where the only thing that was high was Aluminum. She gave me a bunch of supplements to take, which I did and had me correct my diet, which I have but disappointed that nothing really significant came up in the tests I never went back to her.

    She said that she wanted to work on detoxing the next time I saw her. I then started looking into Lyme/Co-infections from the advice of several people on this board so I had my doctor run a Igenex WB test, which was negative but did have several reactions on specific bands so that had me go see a Lyme Doctor in Sept where she ran co-infection testing where I was found positive for Babesia Microti. At that point she started treating with Antibiotics Zithro/Mepron but I didnt see any real herxing/changes only that the meds were making my already sensitive stomach worse so she added Flagyl which I was on for 2 weeks but I had to get off of all meds because I really felt like they were killing me.

    I havent ben back to see the Lyme Doctor because I feel that I cant handle those meds at all. I went to see Dr Lerner in Michigan and I am still waiting on my test results and have to go back in about a week to finish testing but I just dont know if I want to be put on more meds. He feels confident that he could help me but I just dont know. Its so very frustrating not knowing why you are so sick and just trying different doctors and different treatments out of desperation. I really hope that Dr Farr can help.




    Thats so great that he was so thorough and he has a gameplan for you. I really hope that he is able to help. It sure sounds like he can. Thank you for filling me in and keep us posted on your progress.


    Thanks again for pointing me in the direction of Dr Farr and for all of your valuable information.

    [This Message was Edited on 11/14/2008]
    [This Message was Edited on 11/14/2008]
  5. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    Hi Mike,
    Dysbiosis (also called dysbacteriosis) is the condition of having microbial imbalances on or within the body and normally occurs in the digestive tract. You can't "fix" any of our problems without tackling these first as they effect every organ we have, it would be like putting silly putty on a brick wall that is crumbling.

    The testing that Dr. Farr does pinpoints what exactly is causing the dysbiosis.

    Along with the comprehensive digestive stool analysis which test for digestion in detail it also tests for absorption, metabolic markers and microbiology which pathogens you have and immunology and short chain fatty acids and then they will test which antibiotics you are resistant to and which ones you aren't, then they will match them with a natural agent.

    He will do an iodine loading test,too, so he doesn't just fix one problem he will tackle them all.

    Good luck in whom ever you chose! And let us know what yuo decide.


  6. Catseye

    Catseye Member

    I'm with MissAutumn, and also, avoid all antibiotics if you can. They will only worsen the dysbiosis. And it's not the main problem, anyway, the infections. I mean you have to fix the gut to fix the immune system and that's how you're going to get over any infection. I haven't used any drug antibiotics and my lyme count went from 21 to 2 just by diet and supplements. I'm fixing the gut/immune system and it's starting to work again. But antibiotics just mess it up. They may wipe out some bugs you have, but your overall problem will worsen. You have to build back up the good bacteria in the gut and antibiotics are just killing them off. They take a really long time to repopulate, but no time at all to kill, so you are just setting yourself back. If you want to use an antibiotics for an infection, I would go with raw garlic (crushed or chewed) and colloidal silver (I like Source Naturals for their quality and particle size).

    You said you were disappointed about your luck with diet and supplements from the lady doc, but how long did you give it? A really bad case of LG can take months or even a year or two to fix, depending. And you can't cheat at all on the diet. So maybe you could have given it more time or she just didn't have the right diet and supps for you?

    I wish you luck, it's a lot to think about.

  7. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    Thank you for helping me understand about gut dybiosis a little more. I have been thinking back to before I became ill and I have always had a pretty sensitive stomach and when I would get sick as a child would almost always get put on antibiotics out of worry from my mom. I dont know if that has any real significance. I started to change my diet around June to the present and things that I have greatly reduced are sugar, junk/fast food, wheat, dairy, high fructose corn syrup. I try to eat as healthy as I can but it is so difficult. I do need some help as to what I can and can't eat since I have not gone back to my nutritionist.

    I was on the following supplements (Ultra Par, Min Plex B, Betaine HCL, Paleo Greens, FloraMyces, Thyrosine Spray) and I was looking at my (Metametrix GI Function Profile 2100) and my Predominant Bacteria were all above the reference range, everything else looks normal. Have you ladies heard of this test/lab? I was just wondering how accurate this test was since from what I have been reading online is that stool testing in general are not very accurate. I am going to follow up with Dr Farr in the hopes that he could help me. I just have to save up some money for the appointment and questionaire. Should I try to treat any viruses/bacteria found before starting his treatment or do you think that this would be taken care of by getting treated by Dr Farr?

    Thank you both very much for your suggestions and help and I hope that you both continue to see progress with Dr Farr.

    [This Message was Edited on 11/17/2008]
    [This Message was Edited on 11/17/2008]
    [This Message was Edited on 11/18/2008]
  8. sascha

    sascha Member

    but barrowinnovations is the best source for in-depth information.

    i've had gamut of testing and many things have been found wrong. the first phase of my treatment is geared toward strengthening my digestive and immune systems after which we will commence work on my adrenals.

    Dr. Farr is intent on getting to the source of his patients' problems. now i am on a hyper-allergenic diet and a bunch of supplements and already (it has been a matter of some weeks now) i have a sense of getting a jump-start toward better functioning. that's the sensation i am getting.

    demonstrable changes are taking place- like i (as of just a few days ago) found i could stay up past 5 pm; and over the last week and a half or so, could meet up with friends during the day for a period of time without suffering, without collapse, without the crash that so often occurs.

    the main thing i'm noticing is that i WANT to go and do some things (very cautiously) whereas before i DIDN'T want to because i knew i COULDN'T. it's very clear when i don't feel up to something. and i don't push it at all. but now i find i have urge to go and do; to get out; i can enjoy being with a friend. so, point is, something is happening for the good.

    i recommend this approach. i don't think even the best diet in the world would be able to pull me out of the cfids mess i've been in. some people can get better just through foods. i know i'm not one of them. but here i am appearing to be making progress from being on good, healing diet PLUS specific supplements selected for me and my various conditions as revealed through testing, questionnaires, consultations.

    we'll see how it goes. this approach (Dr. Farr's) makes a lot of sense to me. something went wrong, way wrong, and then it's like dominoes with many other things one by one going out of whack. i get the sense that Dr. Farr is, one by one, going to put the pieces together again.

    it's so great feeling better, in fits and starts to be sure- but i seem to be gaining on it-

    good luck! sascha
  9. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    Hi Mike,

    The Comprehensive Stool Test that Dr Farr does is very accurate in pinpointing what is wrong with the digestive system and what bacteria and virus are floating around. I agree with Sascha on the diet, we have to eat healthy- everyone does but since we all are in this mess we need more than eating healthy to fix us. I've learned from Dr Farr that this is so much more involved than just eating the right foods. I was self diagnosing and treating myself and wasted a whole lot of money on supplements that were suppose to help and didn't. Mainly because there is a malabsorption problems and I was treating the symptoms not the cause. With the CSA you know what the problem is and Dr Farr can start from there. Like Sascha he is doing the digestive system first then on to the adrenals/thyroid and hormones and the Lyme.

    Eating healthy is hard when you are so tired you can barely get off the couch. I will roast a whole chicken or cook up chicken legs or thighs and eat them for a few days. I also make up a salad - enough for 2-3 days , so on the bad day I don't have to cook. Meat loaf with organic beef and have that a few days. Even soup. If you have a Farmers Market go there for vegetables, most are organic and not much more than grocery store chains. Getting off sugar is different, that can be one of the hardest things to do, but if you go at it like this way of eating is medicine and will help make you better it is well worth it. The times I have eaten something with sugar in it sure reminded me of why I can't eat that white poison. It was horrible, it took a few hours for the effects to hit- phewy!!!. When I did decide to quit the stuff I had to go gradually, I couldn't go cold turkey. Sounds like quite an addiction, huh!? which it is.

    Some of the tests you can submit to your insurance if you have it. You print out the forms and send them yourself. I sent in the blood tests and will do the CSA.

    I don't know about any of the supplements you were taking or have heard of those test, so I can't comment on them

    Keeps us posted


  10. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    For adding your experience with Dr Farr. This sounds very encouraging and I hope that you continue to see results. I used to be such an active person all year around and since coming down with CFS I have been housebound and sometimes even bedbound. I have an apointment next week with a CFS doctor who treats with antivirals but I really doubt that I will take them because I dont think my body could handle them and I feel thanks to Barrowinnovations that drugs will not fix the root cause(s).

  11. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    I do feel that I eat much healthier since going to the nutritionist, even though I know that my diet could still be much improved. I hear you about the addiction. It is so very difficult and I have greatly reduced sugar but I havent been able to completely get rid of it. I get these cravings at times, especially at night. I used to eat all the sweets glazed donuts, cookies, candy bars, ice cream and I have eliminated all of that but when I get the late night cravings I will eat 1 or 2 oatmeal cookies. I know I must stop 100% and I hope that Dr Farr could find some real issues in the testing that will direct me on what needs to be done.

    I think I read that Dr Farr uses Labcorp for the bloodwork. I hope he does because my insurance only deals with them. Did you have to pay first for the bloodwork then you send it in to insurance company for reimbursement? He wont mail or fax you a script for bloodwork? That would be much easier.

    I just found out that a farmers market has opened up where I live so that makes things easier.

  12. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    Hi Mike,

    I'm in Ca and it's hard to get anyone to do lab work unless the doctor practices here. When I called Quest they suggested the local hospital. I didn't have to pay up front for the blood work there. The hospital submits them to the insurance company. I did have to pay ahead for the CSA, the saliva and the Lyme testing. Thank goodness for charge cards!!

    When you talk with Dr. Farr I would ask what in detail has to paid up front and what can be billed. I think most has to be paid for ahead then you bill the insurance company. It is expensive at first. What I'm doing now is putting aside the money I save on groceries for the next bill.

    The sugar cravings at night were my worst, too. I think that must be when we are tired and our glucose levels drop. I found that taking cinnamon extract in pill form really helps so does chromium picolinate. But make sure the cinnamon is the aromaticum and not the regular one you get at the grocery store. I read that too much of that can be toxic, they are talking about more than 2 tbs a day though.

    Craving chocolate sometimes is a sign of low magnesium, other causes of sugar cravings are low serotonin and low adrenal function which ties in with the low mag and serotonin and the glucose levels. try having fresh fruit instead of baked stuff. And Candida sure can cause the cravings.

    Take little steps in changing your eating habits, big ones are too hard to follow through with. We do need to eat healthy all the time. I thought I was doing fine with eating organic about 80 % of the time until I got my tests result back. We just can not add any more chemicals to our bodies- our gut and immune systems are too messed up. I am a lot older so I know it's a little easier to make these changes, since I've eaten the way I want to most of my life.

    Good news about the Farmers market they are so fun to go! Ours will keep going until it gets too cold for anything to grow. Check out the health food stores, too. I found they also aren't too expensive, sometimes cheaper than the chain stores.

  13. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    Thanks again for your advice it is much appreciated. Did Dr Farr check you for any viruses? Genetic testing? Do you have any pain with your symptoms since you said you tested positive for Lyme? I dont have any pain just CFS symptoms. how long have you been ill? Did your illness start with a sudden or gradual onset? I'm sorry if I'm bothering you with the questions but I was just curious.

    [This Message was Edited on 11/18/2008]
  14. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

  15. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    the questions are okay, I get curious, too about some people. Dr Farr didn't do any genetic testing and he microbiological testing so that includes viruses along with the bacteria and fungi.

    I am in pain. This started when I was guinea pig for the Salk vaccine. I go the live viruses and around 12 is when I started feeling different. My mom kept taking me to doctors - we had Kaiser but even then no one would have diagnosed FM/CF, they just thought it was growing pains and sleeping a lot like kids do. Then when I had my kids it took another big down turn and that time the doctor put off as "nerves" now it's called stress. I thought that was a pretty lame excuse so I just put up with it. If this is all you know then there isn't "normal" to compare to, and I don't like to have people feel sorry me. Then when I was around 45 I got bit by the tick and when things went bad again everyone said it was peri menopause.

    About 5 years ago, I had a lot of dental work done and that really set things off and I went into a major flare- had to close my business and pretty much have been stay at home. So the pain is really bad and all the other weird symptoms, but one thing I was blessed with is a really high tolerance for pain. Unhuman was what my doctor calls it. the anesthetic for all the dental work I had done doesn't work so I have them drilled without it. One of the questions Dr. Farr asks is about pain- your threshold - a high tolerance is because the pituitary gland is messed up! I told I want to get better but I want to keep the high pain tolerance!!! LOL

    So in a way it has been a slow -50 year- progression but then certain things in my life pushed it to a worsening level. Now, I'll be able to find out what it's like to be a normal old lady !!!!! LOL :)

    Mike, did any of your doctors have you take astragalus for the virus? My brother had Hep C and was able to get rid of it by taking the liquid form. It isn't very expensive.
  16. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    I also had some dental work prior to coming down with CFS. I had a root canal on a tooth that had been bothering on and off for several years. I sometimes wonder whether the root canal was one of the things that triggered my CFS. I'm sorry that you have pain but its good that you have a high pain tolerance. None of my doctors have prescribed astragalus or anything else for the viruses. I have been self treating with Olive Leaf Extract and Proboost with no positive change in symptoms. This is why I have been trying to find someone like Dr Farr that looks at the big picture and could recommend things for me based on what is found in my testing.

  17. MIssAutumn

    MIssAutumn New Member

    Dr Farr is a good choice. I had a question for him last night - my time was around 6pm and he was still in the office and answered immediately. It's hard to say what sets this stuff off, I know what did mine but I think with a lot of people somewhere along the way we really messed up the digestive tract. It is so important to eat right! At least now a lot of the doctors and others are seeing all the damage all these chemicals have caused people. Around here all the grocery stores are carrying organic foods.

    It's scary to think what the young kids are all ingesting.

    I even was tested for fluoride and is was positive. So back to using Tom's!
  18. joeb7th

    joeb7th New Member

    And can he help me?

    How can I contact him?
  19. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    Go to this link and you will get a better idea of what Dr Farr does and if he could help you

    or look up Barrowinnovations on here she is very familiar with Dr Farr

    Dr Farr's website is

  20. llelnino

    llelnino New Member

    Do you call him or do you e-mail him when you have a question? I was writing him a message the other day then I read that I could be billed for messages so I never sent it. yeah I have to change my toothpaste as well but I have been so busy trying to change so many other things. Did Dr Farr test you for Lyme co-infections since you tested positive for Lyme?