Discussion in 'Lyme Disease Archives' started by bakeman, Dec 31, 2008.
what does it mean for me?
I doubt that Quest tests for all bands, so it might not mean much except that you should have a Western blot from Igenex.
I also had band 41 present on my Labcorp test, so I'm having an Igenex test on Jan 5.
Band 41 is not species specific....any bacteria etc with a tail (flagella) can cross react and make band 41 show up.
Lyme is a clinical diagnosis, however, and is not diagnosed based on just a lab test. It is based in history, symptoms etc and can be supported by labwork.
All the research I have read states that you really need to have a Western blot done by a reference lab that tests all bands and has the best reliability, like Igenex.
I had my labwork tested by Igenex and I was positive for about 5 different bands on IGM and IGG. However, when I went to a new Infectious Disease Specialist, he said that he didn't know Igenex. He was saying that he could never get any of his patients to show positive on a test from a "regular" lab. He made me go across the street to a hospital and have my blood drawn.
I asked where they were sending it and all they said was Birmingham. I have been on antibiotics for over a month for Lyme and Ehrichilosis, do you think that test will show positive??
Hard to say, I guess. Do you mean that you were on the antibiotics when you had the blood drawn, or you started them after the blood was drawn? Some people who initially tested negatively before antibiotics will seroconvert to positive after a course of antibiotics.
Obviously he thinks you have lyme and ehrlichia....how did he arrive at that diagnosis if he did not believe your Igenex western blot...just by your history and symptoms??
Sounds like that Dr should read Dr Burrascano's paper titled "Advanced Topics in Lyme Disease-Diagnostic Hints and Treatment Guidelines for Lyme and other Tick-Borne Illness", Sept 2005., and also the Guidelines for Management of Lyme from the ILADS.
It is important to treat the patient, not the test, though. Are you having any improvement yet on the antibiotics? Did you get worsening of symptoms after starting the antibiotics?(Herxheimer reaction)...this is caused by die-off of bacteria.
nannie- thanks for the input.
shalome- can you ask your unrelated questions somewhere other than this post? i want to keep it simple. thanks
This is real simple -- This means you either have Lyme, syphilis or dental disease.
If your teeth are not falling out cross off dental disease.
If you don't have syphilis (there is a simple test for the bacteria) or have a history of an STD then you have Lyme.
Plain and simple especially if you have symptoms of fatigue, muscle pain, etc. About 80% of those on Lymenet had a diagnosis of CFS and FM before they found out it was Lyme.
The following two reports by Allen Steere and Yale state that if a person has band 41 (or flagellin), Lyme symptoms, and they do not have severe periodontal disease or syphilis, they have Lyme borreliosis:
1) Allen Steere in 1986, when he developed the first CDC Method to diagnose Lyme, recommended: ” Perform serial Western Blots to look for changing and expanding IgM and IgG antibodies,” since Lyme is a borrelisis, a relapsing fever, and the changing antibodies is a reflection of the varying antigens- and that, THIS CHANGING phenomenon means “the spirochete remains alive throughout the illness.”
In that full text report, Steere said one can distinguish between Lyme and syphilis, when one only sees band 41 (anti-flagellar antibody) in a person complaining of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome or Fibromyalgia.
2) Yale and CT Agricultural experiment Station- the full pdf:
Use of recombinant antigens of Borrelia burgdorferi in serologic tests for diagnosis of lyme borreliosis.
Magnarelli LA, Fikrig E, Padula SJ, Anderson JF, Flavell RA.
Department of Entomology, Connecticut Agricultural Experiment Station, New Haven 06504, USA.
Recombinant antigens of outer surface proteins (Osps) OspA, OspB, OspC, OspE, and OspF of Borrelia burgdorferi sensu stricto and of p41-G, an antigenic region of flagellin of this spirochete, were tested with human sera in class-specific and polyvalent enzyme-linked immunosorbent assays (ELISAs). In analyses for immunoglobulin M (IgM) antibodies, 18 (85.7%) of 21 serum samples from persons who had been diagnosed as having Lyme borreliosis on the basis of the presence of erythema migrans reacted positively in ELISAs with one or more Osp antigens or the p41-G antigen. Eleven serum samples contained antibodies to OspC antigen, and of these, six also reacted to the p41-G antigen and to one or more of the other recombinant antigens. The remaining five serum samples reacted solely to OspC (n = 4) or to OspC plus OspA and OspE without reactivity to p41-G (n = 1). In analyses for IgG antibodies, seropositivity was comparable to that of IgM analyses and was marked by predominant reactivity to p41-G, OspC, and OspF. Similarly, all 21 serum samples were positive in polyvalent and class-specific ELISAs with whole-cell B. burgdorferi. Minor cross-reactivity was noted when sera from persons who had syphilis, periodontitis or other oral infections, or rheumatoid arthritis were tested with OspC, OspE, OspF, and p41-G. With relatively high degrees of specificity, ELISAs with recombinant antigens, particularly OspC and p41-G, can help to confirm B. burgdorferi infections.
PMID: 8788993 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
See Dr Kent Holtorf's page on Lyme -- Why this info didn't trickle down to all FFC docs is what I want to know:
Separate names with a comma.