I have accidentally stumbled upon the cause

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by rge, Nov 12, 2002.

  1. rge

    rge New Member

    I am not alone. I found this;
    While it is not the only cause, it is worth considering.

    Ron

    Posted by Jason 132.148.80.210) on November 06, 2002 at 04:05:17:
    I believe that I have accidentally stumbled upon the cause of Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Gulf War Syndrome, and a number of other so-called "mysterious ailments" in my personal search to find an answer to my own health problems. It appears to me that the cause is in fact related to fluoride toxicity. Specifically in most cases fluoride toxicity related to the group of fluoroquinolone antibiotics.

    Most people are not aware that there are in fact major health problems associated with fluoride. Most of us think that because fluoride is found in both toothpaste and drinking water that it is a relatively safe substance. This unfortunately is far from the truth. Of course in the drinking water fluoride is obviously incredibly diluted, and in toothpaste we normally absorb only trace amounts at most every time we brush. This is far different then when we actually take medications that contain fluoride.

    By ignoring fluoride's side effects as the FDA has done, because it has long viewed fluoride as a necessary evil within our bacteria rich water supplies, it would appear that the FDA has unintentionally given pharmaceutical companies, and in particular those companies who produce the most popular antibiotics in the world, the license to use one of the most dangerous and harmful substances that the medical community has available to it. Environmental groups state that fluoride is actually more toxic to the human body than lead, and in fact nearly as toxic as arsenic. While personally I tend to ignore such groups most of the time, probably like most Americans do, the known side effects to fluoride appear match up very closely to an awful lot of diseases which have either sprung up, or become increasingly popular since these antibiotics began to become widely distributed in the mid to late 80's.

    Fluoride apparently disrupts the synthesis of collagen and leads to the breakdown of collagen in the muscles, tendons, cartilage, bones, kidneys, lungs, and skin. It also can cause permanent severe neurological, immune system, cardiovascular, and gastrointestinal problems, as well as depressing thyroid activity.

    In the majority of people the breakdown of collagen appears to cause the first symptoms. Joint pain, muscle stiffness, and tendon aches are generally among the very first symptoms that are noticed. However in the majority of cases, such symptoms are usually so mild that they are frequently not even noticed at the time the medication is actually taken. This is of course exactly why this problem has gone undiagnosed for so long. Exceptions to this rule generally involve people who are under extreme amounts of stress at the time they take such medications. In these cases, already tense muscles are make even more tense as the breakdown of collagen begins. This is almost certainly why both Gulf War Veterans, and those people who the CDC monitored for possible anthrax exposure in 2001, tended to experience noticeable side effects much more immediately than is typical. Of course neurological problems such as seizures, or gastrointestinal problems such as diarrhea or cramping can also be seen immediately in some cases, either due to increased exposure or simply increased genetic susceptibility.

    In any case, it appears that symptoms for some reason seem to actually worsen over time. Those people who experience mild reactions can over the course of many months or years begin to have more severe related problems, while those people who may not have even noticed any symptoms at all may slowly begin to develop some of those lesser symptoms. The reason for this maybe due to the fact that the fluoride may actually remain in the body in some capacity, possibly become trapped when it crosses the blood-brain barrier which most toxins have difficulty penetrating.

    It appears obvious that the cholesterol-lowering drug Baycol, the weight-reducing drugs Fen-Phen, Redux, and Pondimin, and nearly a dozen of the members of the fluoroquinolone antibiotic group which are no longer on the market, or in some cases never even made it to the market, because they were all even more noticeably toxic as a result of the fluoridation of those drugs combined with their various other chemical elements. That of course still leaves many of the much less noticeably toxic drugs, including some of the most widely prescribed antibiotics in the world, still on the market.
    Anyway, I firmly believe that fluoride has directly contributed to chronic health problems in tens of millions of Americans.
    Feel free to contact me if you have any questions, but please do note that I am a doctor and that I have no scientific evidence to back up such claims. I am simply someone who has had to educate myself because my doctors were at a loss to explain the source of my symptoms.

  2. rge

    rge New Member

    I am not alone. I found this;
    While it is not the only cause, it is worth considering.

    Ron

    Posted by Jason 132.148.80.210) on November 06, 2002 at 04:05:17:
    I believe that I have accidentally stumbled upon the cause of Fibromyalgia, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, Gulf War Syndrome, and a number of other so-called "mysterious ailments" in my personal search to find an answer to my own health problems. It appears to me that the cause is in fact related to fluoride toxicity. Specifically in most cases fluoride toxicity related to the group of fluoroquinolone antibiotics.

    Most people are not aware that there are in fact major health problems associated with fluoride. Most of us think that because fluoride is found in both toothpaste and drinking water that it is a relatively safe substance. This unfortunately is far from the truth. Of course in the drinking water fluoride is obviously incredibly diluted, and in toothpaste we normally absorb only trace amounts at most every time we brush. This is far different then when we actually take medications that contain fluoride.

    By ignoring fluoride's side effects as the FDA has done, because it has long viewed fluoride as a necessary evil within our bacteria rich water supplies, it would appear that the FDA has unintentionally given pharmaceutical companies, and in particular those companies who produce the most popular antibiotics in the world, the license to use one of the most dangerous and harmful substances that the medical community has available to it. Environmental groups state that fluoride is actually more toxic to the human body than lead, and in fact nearly as toxic as arsenic. While personally I tend to ignore such groups most of the time, probably like most Americans do, the known side effects to fluoride appear match up very closely to an awful lot of diseases which have either sprung up, or become increasingly popular since these antibiotics began to become widely distributed in the mid to late 80's.

    Fluoride apparently disrupts the synthesis of collagen and leads to the breakdown of collagen in the muscles, tendons, cartilage, bones, kidneys, lungs, and skin. It also can cause permanent severe neurological, immune system, cardiovascular, and gastrointestinal problems, as well as depressing thyroid activity.

    In the majority of people the breakdown of collagen appears to cause the first symptoms. Joint pain, muscle stiffness, and tendon aches are generally among the very first symptoms that are noticed. However in the majority of cases, such symptoms are usually so mild that they are frequently not even noticed at the time the medication is actually taken. This is of course exactly why this problem has gone undiagnosed for so long. Exceptions to this rule generally involve people who are under extreme amounts of stress at the time they take such medications. In these cases, already tense muscles are make even more tense as the breakdown of collagen begins. This is almost certainly why both Gulf War Veterans, and those people who the CDC monitored for possible anthrax exposure in 2001, tended to experience noticeable side effects much more immediately than is typical. Of course neurological problems such as seizures, or gastrointestinal problems such as diarrhea or cramping can also be seen immediately in some cases, either due to increased exposure or simply increased genetic susceptibility.

    In any case, it appears that symptoms for some reason seem to actually worsen over time. Those people who experience mild reactions can over the course of many months or years begin to have more severe related problems, while those people who may not have even noticed any symptoms at all may slowly begin to develop some of those lesser symptoms. The reason for this maybe due to the fact that the fluoride may actually remain in the body in some capacity, possibly become trapped when it crosses the blood-brain barrier which most toxins have difficulty penetrating.

    It appears obvious that the cholesterol-lowering drug Baycol, the weight-reducing drugs Fen-Phen, Redux, and Pondimin, and nearly a dozen of the members of the fluoroquinolone antibiotic group which are no longer on the market, or in some cases never even made it to the market, because they were all even more noticeably toxic as a result of the fluoridation of those drugs combined with their various other chemical elements. That of course still leaves many of the much less noticeably toxic drugs, including some of the most widely prescribed antibiotics in the world, still on the market.
    Anyway, I firmly believe that fluoride has directly contributed to chronic health problems in tens of millions of Americans.
    Feel free to contact me if you have any questions, but please do note that I am a doctor and that I have no scientific evidence to back up such claims. I am simply someone who has had to educate myself because my doctors were at a loss to explain the source of my symptoms.

  3. sofy

    sofy New Member

    I have read the same info. before on another site and this person said they felt better in 4 days after eliminating fluoride. It cost little to do so I gave it up for 3 months and felt no better or worse. Have no idea if this is enough time to see a difference but I lost faith and am back drinking tap water. Anyone else given it up and noticed an improvement?
  4. karen2002

    karen2002 New Member

    I too researched flouride extensively ---along with many chemicals, metals, etc. I found similar reports. Here are the questions I pose:
    I did look back through your previous post, and as far back as 7/2002 you were looking at flouride toxicity. What has this knowledge afforded you? Have you taken any courses of action to find conclusive evidence in your case that flouride has contributed to your illness, and/or that it is present in your system? Have you taken steps to reverse this toxicity, and if so what? And with what results? I find that most doctors, and those interested in the sciences, when having a hypothesis, usually do the work entailed to prove their theories. I am open to any suggestions that have merit, I, too want to improve my health.
    Karen
  5. sybil

    sybil New Member

    and i have never used toothpaste with flouride in it,

    sybilxxx
  6. rge

    rge New Member

    All,

    sofy - I seem to be very sensitive to it , I felt better - no, I just did not get worse - the day I didn't drink F- water . Nausea improved, daily headaches improved, brain fog improved

    jc -just making sure you are no longer consuming it will not reverse the condition. eliminating fluoride alone will not reverse the condition once it has developed
    I believe you are right on this -

    karen2002 - conclusive evidence ? I am convinced for my own mind just in how I feel, I am not cured

    QEEG before & after drinking F- water for 24 hr. showing CFIDS signature increasing and ability decreasing

    Blood level - 30x normal

    Urine level - elevated over their reference range ( I don't know normal values)

    Regular EEG was abnormal and was actually worse than QEEG because I had been drinking F- for at least 3 days .

    ENG (nerve conduction tests) showed periferal neuropathy in radial & ulnar (arms)

    MRI showing arthritus in cervical verterbrae 5-6 and also herniated disc in same area. I would also like to get x-rays to see if I have any other bone bone abnormalities.

    I am hoping to hear from a toxicoligist about other tests that will be useful.

    I stay away from F- as much as I can and I have not found any protocall for reversing toxicity - I think time is the only reversal- I have started Magnesium Taurine and vitimens

    The best I can say is that I have stabilized.
    I don't have all the answers - but I am working on it

    Ron






  7. sofy

    sofy New Member

    Thanks Ron, please keep us posted on your continued search for answers. I'm am interested and don't discount anything as a possibility.
  8. SharonR

    SharonR New Member

    fluoride toxicity is so harmful to health that many countries have banned it.
    Why do you think people are drinking bottled water?
    We are all looking for a common denominator, well what do we all consume, take baths with, and aren't we just the poster children for antibiotics?
    Someone needs to start a class action lawsuit against any local, state or national agency that forces a community to pay for and use flouridated water. There was a case out West just the other day where citizens voted against the addition, and guess what, local government overrode the vote and did it anyway.
    Most be some of those people that you look at and see nothing but a dull blank stare. no conscience no sensitivity about human life, just that programmed get the job done type personality. Don't these people have family's?

    Not Smiling
    SharonR
  9. rge

    rge New Member

    Funny you should mention this! I am working with some respected people that I have just receintly came in contact with. This is what I wrote to them


    I drink and cook with water from the township next to where I live -
    they pump it straight out of the ground and do not add anything to it
    not even chlorine - verified by state mandated water testing data
    available to the public. I still have to shower in the nasty stuff
    and I am almost certain it is being absorbed through my skin and
    being inhaled. I get pricklys on my back and legs and some itching
    after a hot shower or bath.

    I just recently tested this by going to my lake
    lot where I have a wood fired Finnish style sauna. I get my water
    from the lake and it would have only normal background F- levels. I
    usually have it pretty hot - 130 -150 degrees and do not get any
    reaction. Just last week I took 4 gal of tap water out and used it to
    throw on the stove to make steam. I got the pricklys and was sick
    for 2 days. So I think that I am breathing HF in my home as HF
    vaporizes at 68 degrees.

    I then did a second test and the results were the same.

    Here are some ideas.

    Get the cheep HF dector and see if and what levels of HF gas are present in the exposure chamber we call a bath/shower. If we find high enough levels we could then do a series of blood fluoride tests. Baseline/before showering, then one right after a 20 min. shower, and then a couple more at - say - one hour intervals. I say this because fluoride poisoning has a delayed response unless it is an acute exposure.

    The same protocall could be used for a bath. Fluoridated water was sucessfully used to treat hyperthyroidism at the begining of this century.

    hyperthyroid fluoride bath (google search)


    We also need a list of the lawyers that have tried to fight this so we can ask specifically where they lost the battle, then an effective offense can be planned.

    These same lawyers could be used to review new cases so people like me would have guidelines on whether we should proceed.

    Ask your toxicologist - what specific tests and results ranges are needed to prove F- poisoning. Lets get a list together.

    I would love to talk to some of the actual people who you refered to in our earlier conversations. It would be interesting to see how they discovered their problems, and any effective treatments they have come across. You have my permission to give my e-mail address to all of them.


    I really want to help!

    Sincerely

    Ron

  10. polliwog

    polliwog New Member

    I took Cipro years ago when I had Penumonia. I was very sick and had breathing difficulties that I attributed to my asthma that I have had for years. I was being treated at home by a GP who had prescribed C-Clor for me (a related drug I believe) I had been on it for several days, and of course it was at Christmas time when everybody was gone or very busy. So, I called him and told him my problem with my breathing and he said he would prescribe another drug for me---CIPRO. I took the first pill, lay down on the couch and went to sleep, and suddenly woke up unable to breath at all! I felt as if my larynex had completely closed. I leaped up, my husband grabbed my albuterol inhaler, and started just shooting it in my throat. After about a minute and a half, I started to breath again, with difficulty. I stopped the medicine immediately, and I began to recover. Since that time, I have had reoccurances of this syndrome, and have even been hospitalized in an emergency situation like this since then. I don't doubt that some of my health problems may be related to this.
    WE HAVE TO KEEP ON TOP OF THIS! This is the first time I have heard of this! Polliwog
  11. rge

    rge New Member

    Yes, I was put on cipro because they thought my dizziness that started in 97 was an infection.

    Also put on prozac, paxil, and baycol - I felt bad and took myself off of them

    also be careful of diFLUcan and these - finding the common name is sometimes a real task!


    POISON DISGUISED AS MEDICINE
    Fluorinated Pharmaceuticals:
    Ammonium Fluoride/Benzyl Salicylate
    Ammonium Fluoride/Sodium Fluoride
    Amobarbital/Trifluoperazine Hcl/Diazepam
    Bendroflumethiazide
    Bendroflumethiazide/Amiloride Hcl
    Bendroflumethiazide/Atenolol
    Bendroflumethiazide/Mazindol
    Bendroflumethiazide/Medroxyprogesterone Acet/Meprobamate
    Bendroflumethiazide/Meprobamate
    Bendroflumethiazide/Nadolol
    Bendroflumethiazide/Potassium Chloride
    Bendroflumethiazide/Propranolol Hcl
    Bendroflumethiazide/Timolol Maleate
    Benfluorex Hcl
    Benzoic Acid (a-Bac)/Sodium Fluoride/M-Fluorophos/Benz Ac
    Calcium Fluoride
    Chlorquinaldol/Diflucortolone Valerate
    Clioquinol/Flumethasone Pivalate
    Clioquinol/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Clioquinol/Fluocinonide
    Clioquinol/Flurandrenolide
    Clonidine Hcl/Bendroflumethiazide
    Corticorelin Ovine Triflutate
    Desflurane
    Dexfenfluramine Hcl
    Dichlorodifluoromethane/Trichlorotrifluoroethane
    Dichlorotetrafluoroethane
    Diflucortolone Valerate
    Diflucortolone Valerate/Salicylic Acid
    Diflunisal
    Difluprednate
    Dimethyl Sulfoxide/Fluorouracil/Salicylic Acid
    Diphtheria Toxoid,fluid
    Enflurane
    Ergoloid Mesylates/Flunarizine Hcl
    Ethyl Chloride/Dichlorotetrafluoroethane
    Fenfluramine Hcl
    Flubendazole
    Flucloronide
    Fluconazole
    Fluconazole/Dextrose-Water
    Fluconazole/Sodium Chloride
    Fluconazole/Sodium Chloride 0.9%
    Flucytosine
    Fludarabine Phosphate
    Fludrocortisone
    Fludrocortisone Acetate
    Fludrocortisone Acetate/Selenium Sulfide/Hexamidine
    Flufenamic Acid
    Flufenamic Acid/Chlorzoxazone
    Flufenamic Acid/Myrtecaine/Diethylamine Salicylate
    Fluindione
    Flumazenil
    Flumequine
    Flumethasone Pivalate
    Flumethasone Pivalate/Detrothyronine
    Flumethasone Pivalate/Salicylic Acid
    Flumethasone Pivalate/Salicylic Acid/Coal Tar
    Flunarizine
    Flunarizine Hcl
    Flunarizine Hcl/Calcium Dobesilate
    Flunisolide
    Flunisolide/Menthol
    Flunitrazepam
    Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Fluocinolone Acetonide/Emollient
    Fluocinolone Acetonide/Lidocaine Hcl (anest)
    Fluocinolone Acetonide/Lidocaine Hcl (anest)/Bis Sg(ptv)
    Fluocinolone Acetonide/Pramoxine Hcl
    Fluocinonide
    Fluocinonide/Emollient
    Fluocinonide/Procinonide/Ciprocinonide
    Fluocortolone
    Fluocortolone Caproate/Fluocortolone Pivalate
    Fluocortolone/Dibucaine Hcl
    Fluocortolone/Fluocortolone Caproate
    Fluorescein
    Fluorescein Sodium
    Fluorescein Sodium/Benoxinate Hcl
    Fluorescein Sodium/Hyaluronate Sodium
    Fluorescein Sodium/Lidocaine Hcl (anest)
    Fluorescein Sodium/Proparacaine Hcl
    Fluoride Ion/Calcium/Multivitamins W-Iron
    Fluoride Ion/Iron/Vitamins A,c,and D
    Fluoride Ion/Multivitamins
    Fluoride Ion/Multivitamins W-Iron
    Fluoride Ion/Prenatal Multivitamins W-Ca,fe
    Fluoride Ion/Pyridoxine Hcl/Vitamins A,c,and D
    Fluoride Ion/Vitamin E/Vitamins A,c,and D
    Fluoride Ion/Vitamins A,c,and D
    Fluorometholone
    Fluorometholone Acetate
    Fluorouracil Fluorouracil/Epinephrine
    Fluoxetine Hcl
    Fluoxymesterone
    Fluoxymesterone/Ethinyl Estradiol
    Fluoxymesterone/Vitamin E/Ginseng
    Flupentixol Decanoate
    Flupentixol Hcl
    Fluphenazine
    Fluphenazine Decanoate
    Fluphenazine Enanthate
    Fluphenazine Hcl
    Fluprednisolone
    Flurandrenolide
    Flurazepam Hcl
    Flurbiprofen
    Flurbiprofen Sodium
    Fluspirilene
    Flutamide
    Fluticasone Propionate
    Fluvastatin Sodium
    Fluvoxamine Maleate
    Gentamicin Sulfate/Betamet Diprop/Fluocinonide/Sal Acid
    Hexafluorenium Bromide
    Hydralazine Hcl/Bendroflumethiazide/Propranolol
    Hydroflumethiazide
    Influenza Virus Trivalent
    Influenza Virus Vacc,specific
    Isoflurane
    Isoflurophate
    Isopropamide Iodide/Trifluoperazine Hcl
    Methoxyflurane
    Modified Fluid Gelatin/Sodium Chloride 0.9%
    Modified Fluid Gelatin/Sodium Chloride/Calcium
    Modified Fluid Gelatin/Sodium Chloride/Calcium/Lytes/Nitrog
    Modified Fluid Gelatin/Sodium/Potassium/Magnesium Salt(rep)
    Monofluorophosphate/Calcium Carbonate
    Morniflumate
    Na M-Fluorphosphate
    Na M-Fluorphosphate/Calcium
    Na M-Fluorphosphate/Calcium Carbonate
    Na M-Fluorphosphate/Calcium/Brewers Yeast
    Na M-Fluorphosphate/Glucose Oxidase/Lactoperoxidase/Muramid
    Neomycin Sulfate/Flumethasone Pivalate
    Neomycin Sulfate/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Fluocinonide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Fluorometholone
    Neomycin Sulfate/Flurandrenolide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Gramicidin/Nystatin/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Halquinols/Fluprednidene
    Neomycin Sulfate/Isoconazole
    Nitrate/Diflucortolone Neomycin Sulfate/Nystatin/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Nystatin/Fluocortolone
    Neomycin Sulfate/Polymyx B Sulf/Fluocin Acet/Lido (anest)
    Neomycin Sulfate/Polymyxin B Sulfate/Fludrocort/Lido (anest)
    Neomycin Sulfate/Polymyxin B Sulfate/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Neomycin Sulfate/Polymyxin B Sulfate/Phenyleph/Fluocin Acet
    Neomycin/Fluocinolone Acetonide
    Nicergoline/Flunarizine
    Niflumic Acid
    Niflumic Acid/Hexetidine
    Nortriptyline Hcl/Fluphenazine Hcl
    Nystatin/Fluocinolone Acetonide/Metronidazole
    Penfluridol
    Perfluorochemical Emulsion
    Pertussis Vaccine,fluid
    Polymyxin B Sulfate/Fludrocortisone/Lidocaine (anest)
    Pseudoephedrine/Diflunisal/Azatadine
    Rauwolfia Serpentina/Bendroflumethiazide
    Rauwolfia Serpentina/Bendroflumethiazide/Potassium
    Rauwolfia Serpentina/Flumethiazide/Potassium
    Rauwolfia Serpentina/Hydroflumethiazide/Potassium
    Rauwolfia Serpentina/Hydroflumethiazide/Sodium
    Reserpine/Bendroflumethiazide
    Reserpine/Hydroflumethiazide
    Reserpine/Protoveratrine/Hydroflumethiazide
    Sevoflurane
    Sodium Fluoride Sodium Fluoride/Ascorbic Acid
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium Carbonate
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium Carbonate/Vit C/Vitamin D/Vit B6/Ca
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium Phosphate/Calcitriol
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium Phosphate/Ergocalciferol/Vit B12
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium Phosphate/Multivitamins
    Sodium Fluoride/Calcium/Magnesium Salt(rep)/Ergocalciferol
    Sodium Fluoride/Cetylpyridinium Chloride
    Sodium Fluoride/Cholecalciferol
    Sodium Fluoride/Copper Sulfate
    Sodium Fluoride/Cyanocobalamin/Pyridoxine/Thiamine
    Sodium Fluoride/Formaldehyde
    Sodium Fluoride/Hydrogen Fluoride
    Sodium Fluoride/Phosphoric Acid
    Sodium Fluoride/Pyridoxine Hcl/Vitamins A,c,and D
    Sodium Fluoride/Sodium Acid Phosphate/Phosphoric Acid
    Sodium Fluoride/Sodium Bicarbonate (alk)/Hydrogen Peroxide
    Sodium Fluoride/Sodium Biphosphate
    Sodium Fluoride/Sodium Hydrogen Phosphate/Manganese/Lithium
    Sodium Fluoride/Sodium/Potassium/Calcium/Magnesium Salt(rep)
    Sodium Fluoride/Stannous Fluoride
    Sodium Fluoride/Stannous Fluoride/Hydrogen Fluoride
    Sodium Fluoride/Vitamin A Palmitate/Ascorbic Acid/Vitamin D
    Sodium Fluoride/Zinc Chloride (top)/Cetylpyridinium Chloride
    Spironolactone/Bendroflumethiazide
    Spironolactone/Hydroflumethiazide
    Stannous Fluoride
    Sulfacetamide
    Sodium/Fluorometholone
    Talniflumate
    Tetanus Toxoid,fluid Tetrahydrozoline Hcl/Fluorometholone
    Tetrahydrozoline/Fluorometholone
    Trichloromonofluoromethane
    Trichloromonofluoromethane/Dichlorodifluoromethane
    Trifluoperazine Hcl
    Trifluoperazine Hcl/Tranylcypromine Sulfate
    Trifluoperazine Hcl/Tranylcypromine Sulfate/Diazepam
    Trifluperidol Hcl
    Triflupromazine
    Triflupromazine Hcl
    Trifluridine
    Triflusal
    Yohimbine/Fluoxymesterone/Cyanocobalamin/Strychnine/Minerals


    Ron
  12. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    My doc gave me Cipro last year for a bladder infection. I thought I was going to die with labored respiration and was about ready to head for the hospital.

    Also, I got very sick after having one of those fluoride rinses at the dentist. I never get them anymore.

    Love, Mikie
  13. tamara!

    tamara! New Member

    I was reading a article on this webpage, "The Poisoning of America" http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/ID/4072 and I think it adds more light to the situation if you read the whole thing. I was on cipro many times when I was young because I had reactions to many other meds. This is the first time I've heard about this problem. Maybe the fluoride in the water and the toothpaste alone isn't as bad as the larger doses in the meds, but taking the meds. may start a more severe reaction to our use of daily fluoride. I always get a rash after I take a shower and I use to get sick if i drank tap water. I didn't know fluoride could cause that.
    TAMARA!
  14. lucky

    lucky New Member

    I admire your optimism and belief. Lucky
  15. ssMarilyn

    ssMarilyn New Member

    I quit drinking fluoridated water 4 years ago and shortly afterwards hit bottom as far as my health was concerned. I have drank treated water all my life, and when I stopped, it was almost as if my body was going through withdrawal symptoms. Now when I go to someone's house or a restaurant and taste the water, it's enough to make you gag!! I also found some fluoride-free toothpaste on the Internet, but still use a fluoridated kind also. I am going to quit that as soon as it's gone.

    How do we get rid of the fluoride in our water?? Is there a special contraption we have to buy? I don't mean a filter for the kitchen sink either, because I use only filtered water from the grocery store for drinking.

    Marilyn :)
  16. tamara!

    tamara! New Member

  17. karen2002

    karen2002 New Member

    My original response was not as detailed as I would have liked, due to time constraints. Your original title has thrown me for a bit of a loop.... "I have stumbled on the Cause". I don't believe the cause is known yet, as you also stated below your title.
    As I mentioned I have researched some toxins attributed to some of these related disorders. I am convinced that toxins do attribute to these disorders, and they come in many shapes and sizes. Bacterias, Fungis, Viruses, Chemicals, Compounds, etc. Whether they are causitive or exasperbate is very much theory. So many things about these related disorders are so circular. We can often pinpoint the systems down, and the causes of such, it is usually impossible to determine which was the initiator, or the absolute causitive factor, in these disorders. (So far).
    Since we have so many systems down, I do think that its important to find evidence of these systems misfunctioning, and proceed to return them to the best state of health possible.
    That being said, I am hesitant to claim anyone one factor as being causitive. I think if one thing is singled out, we miss the broad picture, and that can be detrimental to our health. Believe me, I am convinced in my own case, that I have been affected by harsh exposures to pollutants, chemicals, compounds, and metals, as I grew up in the 50s-70's in the hometown of the world's second largest chemical manufacturing company (before they were regulated, and watched). I am researching the various chemicals and compounds (napom, agent orange, vinylchlorides, polychlorides, dioxins, etc.) they manufactured during that time that have affected my body, and what can be done in terms of treatments. I hesitate to call this exposure "causitive", at this time though (contributive, perhaps). I am one of those people that need to find evidence, however. Not only evidence but to see how they correlate with my bodies own misperformance, and to what extent. It is imperative as I set up my list of priorities to be investigated, that I can prove that they are affecting or have affected my system, to what degree, and that I can find proven methods for treatment of such, if the need arises. Time is of the essence, though,--not, mistakenly singling in on one component, and overlooking another is paramount. Yes, we do live in a toxic world, but I feel I need to start out with the most toxic, intrusive, and damaging of those toxins--in my own case. I need to concentrate on those systems down, and begin the slow process of reparation.
    As far as the list of "poisons disquised as medicines", I think one must be careful in adopting this attitude. There are many benefical medicines listed. Some have alergies and intolerances to particular medicines, certainly. There are some medicines that impact other systems in the body when used, but to claim that all are poisons, when in fact many are life-saving, or health improving, is to frighten someone, who could greatly benefit.
    I have existed solely on well water for the last 24 years, and the flouride I have been exposed to is so minimal, presently, I am concentrating on much more obvious, and clear antagonists to my lack of wellness.
    Best Wishes in your quests for good health.
    Karen
    [This Message was Edited on 11/14/2002]

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