IAN... Need your help....

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia and ME & Chronic Fatigue Syndrome' started by Godismystrength, Feb 22, 2013.

  1. ,,, for your response and feedback...

    One thing I forgot to put on my list is that I take 400 IUs of Vit. E oil at night before I go to bed. I do that about an hour AFTER taking my sleep supps and I take it in liquid form. The reason I take it last thing before bed is because I read a while ago that Vit. E interferes with absorption of certain other vital vitamins and minerals.

    I never thought about it till now, but could the Vit. E oil be interfering with quality sleep by any chance? I hope not, because I feel the Vit. E oil is important.

    And I have never taken vitamin K2 that I know of, unless there is some in my multi vitamin. How important is the K2?

    Hopefully I can get all this sorted out soon and start seeing some improvement... One step in the right direction is getting off the NyQuil after 2 weeks on it... I didn't sleep as well without it last night, but I'm sure the effects of the drugs in it along with the alcohol that's in it had to be impacting my ME/CFS and MCS...

    Thanks again, Ian, for your help and feedback... I appreciate it so much...

    Blessings,
    Shel
  2. GeminiMoon

    GeminiMoon Member

    I suffer from both CFS & Fibromyalgia. I have found that Magnesium made a huge difference in how I felt. I take 800 mg per day. Have you thought about bumping your Magnesium intake up?

    Thanks
  3. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    Vit E will not affect your sleep.

    Vit K2 helps to ensure proper calcium balance when taking vitamin D and calcium. In particular Vitamin K2 participates in carboxylation of Matrix Gla Protein (MGP), a very potent inhibitor of arterial calcification, in turn lowering the risk of vascular damage.

    So when taking vitamin D in excess of 1000IU it is important to take, roughly:
    magnesium 100mg per 1000IU vitamin D
    vitamin K2 100mcg per 1000IU vitamin D
    zinc 5mg per 1000IU vitamin D
    Molybdenum is also helpful (normally found in a multivite)
  4. ... I haven't been on the board in a couple of weeks since both of my daughters were in town for about 10 days. And my oldest daughter was already sick with a respiratory virus or infection when she left England to come home... So of course I caught what she had... And this is after I had just gotten over a similar illness that hung on for weeks... Unbelievable...

    But thanks for the info and input...GeminiMoon, you are so right about the importance of magnesium. I used to take about 1000 mg/day, but now I take 500 mg of magnesium a day which would follow Ian's suggestion of 100 mg per 1000IU OF Vit.D since I take 5000 IUs of Vit. D... As long as taking more magnesium won't throw other elements out of balance, I'm open to taking more.

    Ian, I def think I need to add the Vit. K2... After reading up on symptoms of deficiency of Vit. K, I think I've prob been deficient for years... My multi has no Vit. K in it, so I think I'll start taking between 250 mcg and 500 mcg... Ian, if you think it's safe for me to take the 500 mcg (since I take 5000 IUs of Vit. D) then I will go with that.

    Just recently (for a couple of months now) I have had a problem with a very small bump/growth that has appeared on the side of my nose that itches and if I scratch it, it starts bleeding profusely... It takes forever for me to get it to stop bleeding... Pressure doesn't work... And even using a septic pencil (my husband's that he uses to stop bleeding if he cuts himself shaving) still doesn't work right away.

    In fact tonight, just as I was about to go to sleep, I had to blow my nose and this tiny thing started bleeding and wouldn't stop... I can't get over how much blood comes from something so small... And even while putting pressure on it, the tissue just gets saturated with blood... Took me over an hour to finally get this thing to stop... So I def think the Vit. K is needed here...

    I can't thank you enough, Ian, for your help and suggestions... And thank you too, GeminiMoon for your input... I appreciate it more than I can say...

    Blessings,
    Shel
  5. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    Yes go with the 500mcg vitK2. Some preparations have different form of vitamin K.
    Usually some K1 some K2(menaquinone-7) and some K2(menaquinone-4). These mixtures are OK too. But don't take K1 by itself.

    I don't think you will benefit from taking more than 500mg magnesium.

    If the vitamin K does not help your bleeding then you could consider increasing your zinc to 25mg.
    [This Message was Edited on 03/17/2013]
  6. SherylS

    SherylS Member

    I have the same spot on the side of my nose! Have been told it is a small mole. If I accidentally scratch it, bleeds forever!
    Ian, I am the person who gets insomnia from Vitamin D. I was taking 5000iu of D3 and all the cofactors. Like I said, I stopped everything and then started over one supplement at a time. Every time I get to the D, insomnia!! Is it true D isn't really a vitamin but actually a hormone? So maybe it throws off my other hormones and/or cortisol.
  7. IanH

    IanH Active Member

  8. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    Sheryl, what is the vitamin D3 preparation you are taking?
    Is it vitamin D only?
    Is it in an oil in the capsule or is it in a white powder in the capsule?
    Is is a clear gel cap or hard cap or is it a coloured cap eg white?

    Vitamin D3 is not a hormone but it is converted into its active form 1,25-dihydroxyvitaminD, which is a hormone. The conversion occurs in two steps, first in the liver then the kidney by two different enzymes. The blood test measures the first converted form 25-hydroxyvitaminD. It is mostly assumed that the measure of 25,(OH)vitaminD is an accurate reflection of the amount of 1,25(OH2)vitaminD but in some cases it may not be. Such people may have a gene which is converting 25,(OH)D to 1,25(OH)D at a poorly controlled rate. But this is just a theory.

    However you could get your levels checked.

    There have been no studies showing that vitamin D3 supplementation interferes with sleep. However if it does then it is probably an interaction with something else. Most well known is alcohol.

    A few people with ME/CFS have stated that vitamin D supplementation caused them some sleep problems - no one has an explanation.

    One thing you could try before taking any vitamin D is to get your magnesium levels high by taking 500mg daily (250 am and 250 pm) for two weeks and 500mg calcium for the second week, then start on 1000IU vitamin D3 daily, upping that by 1000IU after two weeks etc.
  9. Thanks, Ian for your helpful input once again... I will keep the higher dose of zinc in mind if the bleeding doesn't get better... I started the Vit. K today, but my husband said that our health food store only had it in 90 mcg gelcaps... So unfortunately, until I find something better, I have to take many of these pills to get close to the 500 mg... At least their small and easy to swallow...

    Ian, do you know if the Vit. K needs to be taken with other elements for proper absorption? Or if it should be taken separate from certain vitamins or minerals for better absorption?

    SherylS, small world, right? I can't believe you have to deal with the same issue! Don't you just hate it?! Does yours bleed as frequently as mine? It drives me crazy! I guess mine COULD be a small flesh-colored mole... I hope that's all it is, because I've been concerned it could be skin cancer... And I don't want to have to deal with THAT again... Two times is PLENTY...

    Jam, thanks for the suggestion... I do sometimes put Vit. E oil on it when I think about it... But didn't know Vit. D could help too... (btw, my mom suffers with psoriasis, so I will pass that tip on to her to try)... But since I take 5000 IU of Vit. D, shouldn't that be enough to help? Or does it need to be rubbed directly on it?

    Thanks again, everyone... Y'all are a blessing!

    Blessings,
    Shel
  10. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    Psoriasis is effectively treated with BOTH UV light and vitamin D cream. In the absence of the UV the cream will help.

    If your Mom get Psoriasis regularly then investment in a UV light would be worthwhile. It will keep it at bay.

    You don't need to take the 500mcg vitamin K2 if they are just 90mg caps, start with 270mg. ie three caps. Vitamin K needs no other factors. You are taking it as a co-factor for the vitamin D3.

    I don't know the condition of your skin but one of the things that helps skin a lot is this mixture:
    vitamin D3 (as you already take)
    zinc 25mg daily
    Ascorbic acid wash ( This is best achieved by buying a simple unperfumed body wash and mixing 1 tsp ascorbic acid per 100 ml of body wash.) Only wash with this mixture. (except for your hands maybe) NEVER use soap on your skin, it is alkaline and will promote fungal growth and damage to the skin which can be worse if you have ME/CFS.
    [This Message was Edited on 03/17/2013]
  11. .. I will pass those great suggestions along to my mom... She's suffered with psoriasis since she was a teenager... She used to get PUVA treatments years ago at her doctors office, which I think was a type of UV treatment... Is the UV light you're talking about basically a "sun lamp"? Like what folks use to tan with?

    And thanks for your input regarding the Vit. k and zinc... I am taking the 270 mcg to start, as you suggested. I probably need to add a little more Zinc to my regimen since I'm only getting about half the amount you mentioned... Just not sure if the Zinc comes in small dosages... I would only need another 12.5 mg a day... But I will look into that...

    And thanks for the info on the ascorbic acid wash... Never heard of that... I have been using a glycerine soap that is all natural, but have to order it... Can't buy it in stores... It's made with coconut milk and nut extract oils... Is that not good either?
    And isn't ascorbic acid the same as Vitamin C? Because I do have Vit. C powder that I dissolve in juice each day...

    Thanks again, Ian, for all your help! God bless you!

    Blessings,
    Shel
  12. SherylS

    SherylS Member

    What I have is Vitamin D3 only, it is a white powder in a clear capsule. I don't drink alcohol at all. I have been taking magnesium for awhile now, quite a bit before I started the D. I can't take calcium supplements, they cause kidney stones for me. I have checked my 25,D levels but not 1,25 levels. I usually purchase my own blood tests and haven't found
    one that offers the 1,25.
  13. IanH

    IanH Active Member

    I am asking around about this insomnia with vitamin D.
    Will get back to you on this.