Lack of emotions

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by lillieblake, Jun 23, 2008.

  1. lillieblake

    lillieblake New Member

    I am on paroxetine for depression, was taking zoloft but wanted a change.

    Now I have no feelings or emotions.

    If I decrease the dose, I want to kill people, but emotionlessly, if you can understand that.

    I just put a cat to sleep. Oh, well, just another cat.

    And that is not the usual me.

    Just wondering if I should try to change back to zoloft, or if this emotionless feeling suits me better as I try to get SSDI.

    Confusedly, Lillie.
  2. Leaknits

    Leaknits New Member


    This might not relate at all to your post but there is a condition called Anhedonia...lack of joy.

    From the way it feels to a person (THIS person anyway) it just about has to spring from horrible depression.

    I've no idea at all what to do about it. Mentioned it once to my dr and his only thought was to send me to a shrink. My gosh, I'm sad, not nuts!!
    Or has sadness become a sure-as-H*** indication of insanity? Nobody told me that it has but I don't get out in public much.

    Flattened emotions seem to come along as extra baggage with this d'd.

  3. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    Have you thought about trying natural supplements? My niece was on Paxil for 4 years. She didn't feel depressed on it, but like you, just didn't feel much of anything. She finally got tired of being numb and got off of it. To me that would be like a living death, not to feel.

    The amino acid 5-htp helps your brain produce serotonin, without the nasty side effects of SSRIs like Paxil (paroxetine).

    So I don't think you have to choose between zoloft and what you're on now.

    Also, you can look into St. John's wort - it helps a lot of people. I do think 5-htp has helped me stay sane wrestling with CFIDS. It also helps me with sleep. I take 150 mg. a day.

    Take care --

  4. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    I've just gotten a book by a researcher named Richard Deth, from Northeastern University. It's called "Molecular Origins of Human Attention: The Dopamine-Folate Connection."

    Deth is a researcher who mostly has looked at autism. He now is working on CFS, in conjunction with a variety of other CFS specialists. Rich van K told me about him.

    I've not read the book yet, but his hypothesis seems to be that toxins clog up the dopamine receptors. Toxins obviously can result from insufficient methylation, and I believe that biotoxins (e.g. poison mold and lyme) can do the same thing.

    Dopamine is the chemical responsible for pleasure. Without enough dopamine, everything goes flat and dull. If dopamine is even more insufficient, people get things like Parkinson's Disease, where everything (thoughts, feelings, movement) slows down or stops.

    It's my understanding that most things that affect dopamine either supplies more dopamine (cocaine) or causes dopamine to remain more available to the cells (antidepressants). The assumption is that the problem with dopamine is that there's not enough of it.

    However, if the dopamine receptors are clogged up with gunk, they're not going to get the benefit of dopamine even if there's a lot around. Thus, stuff that causes other people to feel good (like antidepressants or happy events) may not have as much of a positive effect on us.

    My understanding of autistic people is that their emotions tend to be extremely flattened. If indeed CFS is basically the same disease as autism (which people like Rich van K seem to be concluding that it is), then it would make sense that our emotions are flattened too.

    My hope is that with enough scrubbing of the receptors with detoxification, the dopamine receptors will become clear and my own ability to feel things (and others' abilities) will become better. Anhedonia is a really annoying symptom, though admittedly it's better than feeling really bad.

    Perhaps I should note that the one thing that consistently makes me feel better is sex (or specifically orgasm). That seems to be a positive feeling created more by hormones than neurotransmitters, and so maybe the dopamine receptors being clogged up aren't as limiting.

    One hormone that I know is released in great quantities during orgasm is called oxytocin. This is available in compounded form, and indeed I do get a bit of "happiness for no reason" feeling when I take it. There is some suggestion in the literature that CFS patients often are low on this (I think it's mentioned in Teitelbaum's book), and so that could be worth trying. It costs about $1 per pill at the pharmacies I've used.

    Thinking that we are somehow to blame for flattened emotions is sort of annoying. And while it could be that certain antidepressants flatten it even more, I'm not convinced that (at least for me) any of them would relieve this symptom. At one point I had tried everything on the market, and none of them did a thing for that symptom.
  5. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    Lamictal is the one drug that really has helped me.

    Just prior to getting sick with CFS, I had a head injury that knocked my mild cyclothymia into much more annoying manic-depression. I felt really awful at times with that problem, and the other mood stabilizers (e.g. Depakote) pushed me down into constant depression.

    Lamictal's been great at keeping me feeling stable and okay. It feels like I don't have manic-depression any more, which is great. One disease down, one to go!

    I don't think it's made me feel happy though. And the addition of the usual antidepressants to lift my mood up have been really best not helping, at worst making my moods less stable again.

    Nofool has found Lamictal (prescribed years ago by Dr. Goldstein) helpful for his CFS, he says. I don't know if he previously had a tendency towards bipolar or not. So maybe it could be worth trying for some CFS'ers. It's one of the few drugs (along with Klonopin) that I've been able to tolerate without getting sick, and so it could be worth a shot.
    [This Message was Edited on 06/24/2008]
  6. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    I’ve not done a lot of reading in the mood disorder literature since the turn of the millennium, when I got my own problems under control. I’ll give you what was believed to be the case back then though. If you want to check, there’s a new edition of the Goodwin/Jamison textbook that is supposed to be pretty good. The previous edition was a godsend to me, especially since the Internet didn’t provide much info back then.

    If you are made manic as a result of taking antidepressants, you are what is called “soft bipolar.” Sometimes this is called Bipolar III or maybe even Bipolar IV.

    The solution is either a) not take any antidepressants or b) not take any antidepressants without mood stabilizers too. Which one you choose depends on whether you feel like you’re depressed.

    (I myself was classified by my psychopharmacologist as “cyclothymic” since I’ve never been depressed for a long period of time and never been anything higher than hypomanic except when on antidepressants. Cyclothymia---thought to be “mild” mood swings---is annoying enough that addressing it was of major concern for me though.)

    Lamictal is a really well-liked drug because it raises moods as well as stabilizes them. The scary rash mentioned on the package insert has to my knowledge only turned up in a couple of cases with people taking just Lamictal. (It used to be prescribed in conjunction with Depakote, which increases the likelihood of the rash dramatically.) Slowly ramping up the dosage with the starter pack is an extra safety precaution. And any skin problems should be reported immediately, even though the very vast majority of them are benign. (A lot of doctors think that with benign skin problems, patients can merely go down on the dosage for a longer period of time and then very gradually go back up again. Probably you need a really experience p-doc to have the courage to do that though.)

    On the other hand, Depakote lowers moods as well as stabilizes them. That’s why antidepressants used to be used as an adjunct. Some people do this with Lamictal, but it seems much less necessary.

    There are a couple of other mood stabilizers that were used eight or nine years ago, but I never heard nearly as much about them as Depakote and Lamictal. There may be some “third-generation” anticonvulsants out now as well, though I’m not sure they’ve been approved for mild bipolar.

    One thing to know about St. Johns Wort is that unless you get a really good brand, it may have no active components whatsoever in it. This may explain why some people get little or no effect from it. A quality product is well worth it here. Look for a product stabilized in terms of hypericum and hyperforin.

    The two supplements that I used for my moods (to supplement the Lamictal as needed) were DLPA and St. Johns Wort. DLPA raised my mood slightly, and St. Johns Wort made me less irritable. Neither of these seemed (on or off the Lamictal) to make my moods less stable. I’ve not found them to be necessary recently, but would not hesitate to re-start if I found those symptoms coming back.

    It was believed the last time I checked that SJW worked more like an MAO-I than an SSRI. MAO-I’s seem less likely than other antidepressants to cause mania (or what my p-doc calls “pinging”), and I could find no reports at the time that suggested that SJW caused them at all. Perhaps more recent studies suggest that they can though.

    The one supplement that I know can cause problems for m-d’s is SAM-e. I would advise those with even soft bipolar to stay far away from it unless moods already are stable.

    I’ve heard a few times recently that SJW only should be used short-term, but I’ve not read enough to know what to make of them. Some say that all antidepressants should only be used short-term. (Certainly they all can be addictive if used for longer periods of time, which could be one reason that those kids did so poorly when they were taken off the drugs and put on SJW.) Maybe the SJW recommendation is to encourage people with serious long-term depression not to avoid getting professional help. Undoubtedly the Goodwin/Jamison book discusses this.

    I took SJW for years and would not hesitate to do so again. Antidepressants all were very bad for me. (The only ones I could tolerate at all were Wellbutrin and the Roche drug Maclobomide, not available in the U.S. And those were not great either.)

    Few of those side effects were mentioned when I was looking into this, and so I think they’re pretty rare. The only one that seems common is sun sensitivity.....the sun can seem brighter and skin burn more easily. It’s hands-down the first thing I’d try for Seasonal Affective Disorder.

    Let me know if you find any new info that contradicts this.
  7. Waynesrhythm

    Waynesrhythm Member

    Hi All,

    I've had fairly extensive experience wildcrafting the St. John's Wort (SJW) plant over the past few years. Luckily it grows wild and abundantly here in southern Oregon and has allowed me to make abundant supplies of both a SJW tincture and SJW oil (SJW buds and flowers soaked in organic olive oil for several months). I researched this herb extensively a few years back and compiled a lot of what I learned into a SJW Information Sheet. I'll paste it below for anybody who may be interested.

    The new SJW harvesting season will be here in another week or so. It usually last 3-4 weeks, and gives us an opportunity to drink a lot of SJW sun tea. It has such a nice calming, refreshing feeling to it.

    Regards, Wayne

    P.S. It may be of interest to some that even though a number of SJW products are standardized by the amount of hypericum, it is not necessarily known with certainty that this component is responsible for most of the beneficial effects of SJW.

    St. John's Wort Information Sheet

    As you read the following, keep in mind the word "calming". St. John's Wort (SJW) tends to calm the nervous system, muscles, and other types of physical discomforts. It even seems to calm the insects that fly around the plant, plus the wild-crafters (us) who thoroughly enjoyed harvesting it.

    Medicinal Uses

    - SJW has been used therapeutically for hundreds of years to fight infections, reduce inflammation and stimulate the immune system. It has very potent anti-viral, anti-bacterial and anti-fungal properties which make it highly beneficial for any type of wound healing. It has also been used historically for nervous disorders, injured or cut nerves, and sciatica (relief for sciatica can occur in seconds using the SJW tincture!). It can be very effective for any type of nerve pain, muscle pain, back spasms, neck pain and cramps, TMJ, stress headaches, and trauma from an accident. It is excellent for skin burns, and very good for other skin abrasions, and skin infections. It can be especially helpful for women with PMS, menstrual cramps, and menopausal symptoms. It has also proven to be highly beneficial for depression, insomnia and other sleep disorders. It is a good stomach tonic for ulcers and gastritis, has even been used for epilepsy, and is a common treatment in Europe for bed-wetting.

    SJW is an herb that combines extremely well with other herbs for enhanced synergistic qualities. It can be used alone or in conjunction with valerian, passion flower, and/or kava for anxiety, nervousness, or depression. It can also be used alone or in conjunction with Vitex (chaste berry), and/or black cohosh as a women's tonic for PMS, menopausal symptoms, etc. It combines well with arnica to serve as a potent pain reliever. It also seems to help the body tremendously in dealing with stress, especially in combination with Siberian ginseng.

    How to Use -

    SJW tincture can be used internally or externally. Taken internally, it is best to start slowly at about 15 drops (approx. 1 dropperful), 1-2x/day and gradually build up to as much as 20-30 drops, 2-3x/day. Drops can be taken under the tongue or in a glass of water. [Note: Alcohol dissipation occurs within minutes when using hot water or tea, and but takes up to 24 hours if using cool water]. Even more can be used in cases of significant stress or depression. Listen to what your body is telling you. Some people will notice effects right away, while others won't notice anything for 2-4 weeks or longer. Both the tincture and oil can be applied externally, applied directly onto muscles, skin or wounds, several times a day. Fibromyalgia pain has been reported to be reduced. [Note: The tincture can easily stain clothes and other items; the oil tends not to stain nearly so easily].

    Side Effects -

    Side effects are rare and generally mild, with reports indicating only about 1% of users affected. Some slight gastrointestinal symptoms are possible (to prevent this take it with meals). A few report mild feelings of anxiety or dizziness (reduce dosage and proceed more slowly). Concerns of increased photosensitivity stem from cattle eating large amounts of it. There is no evidence of any such reactions in humans from normal therapeutic dosages. Any side effects generally stop as soon as the herb is stopped, with no withdrawal symptoms involved.

    Miscellaneous Information -

    SJW can be grown just about anywhere in the U.S. It's therapeutic value for depression is believed to stem from an ability to moldulate numerous brain neurotransmitter levels, including serotonin, norepinephrine, dopamine, GABA and L-Glutamine. These modulated levels tend to alleviate symptoms of depression, and often increase the ability to concentrate, relax and sleep. SJW also contains some powerful antioxidants which quite likely help detoxify the brain. It is also effective for Seasonal Affective Disorder (SAD). For further information on SJW and depression, consider the book St. John's Wort, by Hyla Cass.


    [Following are some of the unique things I did in creating a SJW tincture that is different from most of the commercially available products:]

    This SJW was derived primarily from the buds and flowers of the SJW plant. These components contain many times more active ingredients than the stalks and leaves that are traditionally included in most commercially available preparations.

    In addition to using just the SJW buds and flowers, this tincture was twice macerated. This means that after decanting the tincture from a first soaking, it is then poured over another fresh batch of buds and flowers. This extra potency is reflected in the extraordinarily deep purple color of this tincture.

    These buds and flowers are wildcrafted in a uniquely pristine environment. I feel this environment helps preserve the inherent vital force of this remarkable herb. Some companies actually use large farm machinery to harvest whole fields of commercially grown SJW.

    Considerations When Using a High Potency SJW Tincture

    The deep purple color of SJW contains the same family of antioxidants that make cranberry juice such a good therapy for bladder infections. A high potency tincture makes for a high potency antioxidant and makes it very helpful for many types of internal infections. But some considerations are in order:

    Prescription Drug Considerations:

    Being a very potent detoxifier, SJW has many beneficial effects for a wide variety of physical conditions involving toxicity. But it appears it may also have a tendency to detoxify and lower the level of certain prescription drugs in the body. The FDA maintains a special website that lists categories of prescription drugs they feel may be impacted by SJW. This site currently mentions certain AIDS drugs, transplant drugs and heart medications. The website can be accessed <a href="">here</a>.

    Birth Control Considerations:

    Results from two studies suggest that SJW may render birth control pills less effective. They are evidently metabolized in the same way as the AIDS and transplant drugs mentioned above. Preliminary research had indicated high doses may impair sperm's ability to penetrate an egg. Personal research would be recommended if either of these are a concern.

    Nervous System Regeneration:

    On a positive note, a high potency SJW formula can apparently be ideal when attempting any kind of nerve regeneration. Herbalist Richard Schultze considers SJW in sufficient quantity crucial when attempting nervous system regeneration. He feels SJW, and other nerve stimulators such as skullcap, celery seed and kola nut are superior to using other well-known sedating nervine herbs such as valerian, passionflower, hops, etc. He recommends using an average day's dosage every waking hour, or 1-2 dropperfuls per hour. Building up to this level gradually is the best way to proceed, backing off if necessary. Some people with chronic diseases have an amazing capacity to consume large amounts of SJW, and feel better the more they take. Appropriate dosage is a very individual undertaking, and continual monitoring is advised.

    SJW, by most accounts, appears to be a unique herbal remedy for our times. With the constant stresses and strains we are bombarded with on a daily basis, this herb appears to have unique and powerful qualities to help protect, strengthen and balance our bodies' many systems, especially our neurological system. As with all products, it is wise to keep abreast of any supplement you are taking. Fortunately, SJW is being extensively studied and more scientific data are available all the time. Based on feedback I've received, SJW can truly help transform lives in a variety of ways.

    [Final Note: My partner, a professional counselor who works with many disadvantaged clients, has given away a number of bottles of this SJW tincture, and has gotten almost univerally good feedback. One woman reported she only needed a drop or two to notice significant improvements. Most of the feedback was for alleviated depression and improved sleep.]
    [This Message was Edited on 06/24/2008]
  8. gapsych

    gapsych New Member

    After doing some reading lack of emotions can be CAUSED by depression as well as on the wrong dosage or wrong AD. Confusing isn't it?

    I think that probably talking to the doctor who prescribed your medications would be the best thing to do.

    Take care.


    [This Message was Edited on 06/24/2008]
  9. nina_and_me

    nina_and_me New Member


    I am very concerned about something I read in your post. I am really worried about you. I urge you in the strongest possible terms to please call your doctor today. Lillie, please call your doctor and see if you can be seen today. Please post again and let us know how you're doing.

  10. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    Interesting about SJW being a detoxifier. What have your experiences with it been, Wayne? You seem really attuned to that.

    FWIW, I've developed a "what will be will be" attitude toward most things since getting sick. This causes me, probably regrettably, to be less than totally sympathetic to others who lose loved ones and do not get past it in a reasonable length of time. I always think to myself, we all have such little time on this earth that it's just plain stupid to waste time looking back. Better to just move on and try to make the most of what we have now, before it goes too.

    I think that this is not wholly surprising considering how long I've been sick and that it makes some sort of rational sense, but it does come across to others as cold. Maybe that's part of the flattened feelings. In which case....maybe the flattened feelings are a good thing. Being really upset about all the bad things in my life (many at least as stressful as losing a loved one) certainly wouldn't make my life any better.

    It will be interesting to see if this changes as I "wash out" the dopamine receptors and get better. To the extent that I do get more good things in my life (it takes time to put them there even if one is improving!), it would be nice to be able to _really_ enjoy them.
  11. CanBrit

    CanBrit Member

    Sometimes it's really hard to find the right medication and get on the right dosage.

    I'm currently taking 50mg of Zoloft. I had to put my cat of 16 years down a month ago and boy, I wasn't numb. I've also been having a lot of issues between health and work.

    I asked my Dr. if I should have the dosage increased, and he recommended not, because for the most part the 50mg works for me. He said that the idea is not to numb me out completely, just make life a little more manageable. He's a good doc so I trust him.

    I would go back to your Dr. and discuss this with him.

    All the best,

  12. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    I am reminded here of a movie called "Snow Cake" with Alan Rickman and Sigourney Weaver. It is about an high-functioning autistic woman whose daughter dies. She demonstrates the same sort of flattened emotion that I'm talking about, except to a more extreme degree.

    This seems relevant since a lot of people now think that autism is basically the same disease as CFS, and that the symptoms manifest themselves differently merely because it hits earlier when the brain is still forming.

    Fibro seems to me to be a lot different in this respect. It's hard to pick apart on this board who has which problems, but it seems to me that their emotions are at least as sensitive as those of non-sufferers of the diseases.

    Perhaps that can be attributed to being in pain all the time rather than to the status of dopamine receptors or anything of the sort, though. I'd certainly be on edge if I were in that kind of pain anyway.

    [This Message was Edited on 06/25/2008]
  13. Waynesrhythm

    Waynesrhythm Member

    Hi Gapsych,

    Unfortunately, I checked out about 4-5 books from the library when doing my SJW research, and can only remember one, although I remember drawing on the information in this book more than the others: “St. John’s Wort”, by Hyla Cass. Here’s a <a href="">link</a> to her website.

    Regarding offering the SJW tincture to clients even though it’s not a drug: My understanding is that only licensed physicians can prescribe drugs here in Oregon (and perhaps elsewhere as well). As a certified counselor, Alea would not be able to prescribe drugs. It’s possible her position to offer SJW is unique, although I can’t say for sure. She is given a great deal of flexibility working with abused children and has had some pretty remarkable success using Emotional Freedom Technique (EFT) with them. Her employer even paid for some additional training in EFT a couple weeks ago in support of her efforts.

    Slayadragon - I feel fairly confident that SJW is indeed a potent brain detoxifier. My take is that it had even more of an effect on me than the modulation of my neurotransmitters. Although I would say my own experience with SJW was moderate, I did notice an increase in mental clarity (my guess from the detoxification) and a sense of relaxation (my guess from the neurotransmitter effects).

    I have a younger sister who has suffered even worse than I with CFS and FM. When she started taking this SJW tincture, she had a very significant improvement in so many areas, including increased energy. She took some very high dosages for about 2-3 years, until all of a sudden it wasn’t working for her anymore, and she had to discontinue because of some side effects. Just goes to show that what may work for a while does not always work long-term. Most herbalists recommend using various herbal tonics in a cyclical manner, and this would probably have been good for my sister to do.

    Regarding some of your comments on “what will be will be”. I think your viewpoint has a lot of merit. I think must of us would have ample reason to become overly despondent about so many losses we have had and continue to experience. But I too think it behooves us not dwell too much on this, and to move forward in the best way we know how.

    My perspective on the main topic here of lack of emotions: I tend to think this is part of this health syndrome. Just as many of us experience depression, anxiety, etc., probably as a result of brain chemical imbalances, I think experiencing a lack of emotions is part of this same dynamic. I know I have experienced this myself, with the severity most often coinciding with the flaring up of various other neurological and other symptoms.

    My best success with dealing with this the best I can was, in relative order: Supplementing with specific amino acids to support brain neurotransmitter levels and function; Drinking detoxifying herbal teas (including SJW); and most recently, supplementing with MMS (chlorine dioxide), which I feel is both detoxifying and reducing pathogen levels. I think pathogen levels are given way too little attention in the mental health arena. There’s just so much evidence out there that makes a strong correlation between the two.

    Hi Lillieblake, I wish you the best as you try to get the best answers for yourself. I do feel there are probably some good things to follow up on that could help alleviate some of your symptoms, which I do believe to a large degree result from these complex health issues we deal with.

    All the Best, Wayne
    [This Message was Edited on 06/25/2008]
  14. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    Re side effects - SSRIs actually change your brain's chemistry by preventing the reuptake of serotonin. Dr. Cheney believes that long-term use of these cause permanent, undesirable changes in the brain. I think the changes in brain chemistry from the SSRIs are what cause their often weird, unpleasant and sometimes dangerous side effects.

    5-htp doesn't change your brain's chemistry. It's just the precursor to serotonin. I'm really sensitive to meds and the only side effect I had from the 5-htp was a moderate headache for several days when I first started it. And then it stopped. The other main side effect was that I started sleeping better, and I do think it helps my mood and helps me deal with this DD.

    I think it's like supplementing with vitamin C or eating orange or lemons when you're deficient in vitamin C, as opposed to changing your body chemistry so that it utilizes vitamin C differently. I'd rather just take the vitamin C.

    I've never used St. John's wort, so don't have experience with that.

    We're all told that people need to take ADs because of a chemical imbalance, but if that chemical balance is just a shortage of serotonin, why not go the easy route and just take 5-htp? Cheaper and safer --

  15. tansy

    tansy New Member

    Hi Wayne

    Thanks for all this great info I found it exremely helpful. Like many who have been Dx with ME I cannot tolerate ADs; I had to stay on trazadone for a long time before they would Rx me a sleep med and the longer term use of any tricyclic just made me less able to function and led to a further deterioration generally.

    SJW, on the other hand, worked well for me in the past, and better still could be stopped without any withdrawal Sx.

    I have had to rely upon the bioactive forms of B12 and B6 to encourage peripheral nerve regeneration. They were effective enough pre and post surgery to surprise my surgeon and the neurologist who carried out my nerve conduction tests.

    It looks as though STJ might have been a good adjunct.

    This info on STJ might be missed because the topic it's posetd on may not be read by everyone who wants to know more about STW.

    Wayne would it be possible to start a new topic on STW so that all this invaluable info's in one place? I can use the search facility here with ease on good days but the chronically severely affected can find it overwhelming when the info they're looking for is on many different topics especially the long ones consisting of many pages.

    tc, Tansy
    [This Message was Edited on 06/25/2008]
  16. gapsych

    gapsych New Member

    Tansy,thank you for being the voice of reason.

    We need to get back to Lillie.

    Lillie I know all this information is confusing but please talk to the doctor who prescribed you the medicine as she/he knows how you reacted to your your other medications.

    Depending on how you are feeling, then make a decision on which route to take.

    One step at a time.

    I am going to delete my posts that do not pertain to your post to possibly post elsewhere. I am so sorry that this post got sidetracked.

    Lillie, let us know how you are doing. You have a lot of people rooting for you.

    Take care,

    [This Message was Edited on 06/25/2008]
  17. lillieblake

    lillieblake New Member

    Wow, thanks for all the info. It will take a couple of readings to absorb it all, but on initial reading it sounds helpful.

    I have an appt with my primary doc on Monday and plan to talk to her about going back to Zoloft. I don't want to take any OTC stuff because of interactions of what I RX'd stuff I take.

    But I will try the D3 (I think that is what someone said) because I do vitamins.

    Thanks loads, Love, Lillie

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