ON ABX and Bromelain? READ THIS!!!!!! Mikie/Madwolf/Jelly YOU MUST SEE THIS!

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by judywhit, Sep 3, 2003.

  1. judywhit

    judywhit New Member

    trying to do some research as to herxing and bromelain. I am
    sorry for taking two lines with my post but I just had to get your attention!!!

    just found this little blurb. Will post if I find more info. No wonder Mikie you are going through the HFH (herx from hell)

    Bromelain is an extract from pineapple stem.

    Major increase of the herxheimer reaction when taken with antibiotics (because of improve penetration of antibiotics).

    concentration of antibiotic in tissue increased by :
    ciclacillin - 8.5 fold (850%)
    ampicillin - 5.7 fold (570%)
    cephalexin - 3 to 5 fold (300-500%)
    minocycline - 2.2 fold (220%)

    ***so I gather that bromelain is increasing the amount of abx that gets into the tissue/system by the above amounts! this is very, very good. Jelly needs to see this too!!
    Hang on there guys on abx and bromelain this is just to cool...you are getting better!!!!
    [This Message was Edited on 09/03/2003]
    [This Message was Edited on 09/03/2003]
    [This Message was Edited on 09/03/2003]
  2. judywhit

    judywhit New Member

    and the others see this.
    thanks, judy
    bumping up
  3. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    I appreciate this info. Actually, right now, I am pulsed off the ABX, but I am taking the Famvir antiviral med and I suspect I would have Herxed anyway but the bromelain just made it worse. By removing the fibrin from the blood and increasing the blood's ability to carry oxygen, the mycoplasmas are deprived of their low-oxygen environment where they usually thrive. On top of this, the bromelain allows more of the medication to be absorbed, in effect, increasing the dose dramatically. As you said, no wonder we are herxing.

    I may have to buy some lower GDU stuff and start out a little more slowly.

    Thanks again for this great info. I'm already feeling better. I'm lucky in that the Herxes usually hit me hard but do not last long. This time, my feet did swell, tingle and burn, but it went away as the Herx subsided.

    We will get on top of this nasty business eventually. Until there is a cure, we have to learn how to at least manage our infections. If we can do that, I believe we can live fairly normal lives.

    Love, Mikie
  4. judywhit

    judywhit New Member

    yes I am having a skin rash/reaction to the bromelaine. Could also be part of the herx effect. I started the bromelaine and it was not two days after starting that I got very very sore, tired and inflammed and swollen feeling.
    The rash came about 3 days into the herx. I am taking 500mg 2000GDU 3x per day. The rash is dime sized, raised and not itchy. I am sooooooo glad we are all in this together and can support each other to carry on with our healing. This has been a rough one but I am in for the long haul. Thanks for all your imput. Jelly, I think it is all abx treatments that bromelain inhances- i would think cipro included. I will keep you in my prayers as you have such a busy intense schedule ahead.
    [This Message was Edited on 09/03/2003]
  5. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    Jelly, Cipro has fluoride in it, so if you are allergic to fluoride, you probably should not be taking it. I cannot take it. It makes me feel disoriented and causes labored breathing and nausea. This would be true for any drugs in the fluoroquinalin (sp?) family.

    Judy, yes, we are all in this together and every time I Herx, I thank God that this stuff is working. I'm sorry for you rash. Hang in there but make certain you are not having an allergic reation.

    Madwolf, thanks for the recipe. I'll try it next time I Herx like this.

    Love, Mikie
  6. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    This is par for the course once the Herx passes. I think the body feels really well after shedding some of the nasty little beasties which cause havok for us.

    I really feel for those of you who Herx constantly as this must be horrible. I hope y'all can find some way to kill off the pathogens without constantly Herxing.

    When I Herx, I Herx like hell, but then, it's gone til the next bunch of beasties die off. The Herxes had been decreasing in intensity til I took the bromelain. Wow, what a hit! There has absolutely got to be something to this bromelain stuff. I think I will take it for a while before asking for another SED rate. Maybe I can get it above 3.

    Love, Mikie
  7. ssMarilyn

    ssMarilyn New Member

    Fluoride is toxic, and not only causes all sorts of physical problems and diseases, it suppresses the thyroid. Years ago, fluoride was used to treat "hyperthyroidism". Many dentists now refuse to use fluoride in their offices....good for them. Look up side affects of fluoride on the Internet, and it will shock you. You will never drink unfiltered water again! I even bought toothpaste without fluoride, and a shower filter.

    Marilyn :)
  8. judywhit

    judywhit New Member

    I have tested positive for lupus but on the lower side of the test. If, indeed I do have Lupus perhaps this rash is Lupus related? I have had this rash before taking the bromelain on one other occassion. This was also a time of intense flair and the rash followed several days later.
    Well, just another symptom to deal with.
  9. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    This is true. Fluoridating the water supply is one of the worst things our govt. has ever done for us. We ought to have a choice as to whether we want to poison ourselves or not. I do not drink unfiltered water.

    I do use children's toothpaste and it has a form of it that doesn't bother me. I cannot find an unfluoridated toothpaste that doesn't have some kind of sals in it. I have used hydrogen peroxide and baking soda, but the Barbie toothpaste is just easier to use.

    Love, Mikie
  10. ssMarilyn

    ssMarilyn New Member

    What is sals??

    I use Tom's of Maine toothpaste. Here's the ingredients, why they are needed and where they come from! Tom's tells us everything and I buy his toothpaste on the net. Target has it, but they carry the fluoridated kind. This one has no fluoride.

    Calcium carbonate - light abrasive - Purified calcium bicarbonate

    Glycerin - Moistener - By-product of vegetable oil soap

    Water - Consistency - Branch Brook

    Spearmint & Peppermint Oil - Flavor - Spearmint & peppermint leaves

    Sodium Lauryl Sulfate - Dispersant - Derived from coconut oil

    Carrageenan - Thickener - Seaweed

    Myrrh - Natural resins for a clean, healthy mouth - Resin frm the myrrh bush.

    Propolis - Natural resins for clean, healthy mouth - Mixture of tree resin gathered by bees.
  11. tandy

    tandy New Member

    this might not pertain to much here but in regards to your rash. I also have tested low possitive for lupus,now negative???if you can understand that...your ahead of me~lol So I'm in the wait and see what happens.
    2 different times over the last yr or more,I broke out with a rash also. No dr. was able to say what it was.I saw three!! The third thought it might be pityriosis??and gave me a med pk to take(prednisone).I did'nt take the med pk. I waited it out and it went away in a couple weeks. Never really knew the cause of that one. Since then I had it another time.....I looked it up on the internet(skin rashes)and it looked like a fungal type to me??I compared it to photos given on the sites. Mine both times were all over my torso,belly chest,upper legs...none on my face~ Some small,some bigger,never itched,they were raised and some(the bigger ones)were whitish sorta scaly looking.????
    I guess I'm still trying to figure out whats going on with me...and with you!!is there simularities?(sp?) I'm looking into the mixed connective tissue diseases,inflammatory arthritis conditions,lupus,etc... Also both times the rash does appear when i'm flaring bad.I also get the mottled skin and cold feet and hands~
    Mind you...we both have endometriosis,and a high sed rate. I'm really hoping the herx is about over for ya!! Hang in there...I know its tough~ I've been on the AP myself and went thru a couple nasty herx's!!
    Take care and best to you and your family~
    Tracey :)