SINUSITIS and GUAIFENESIN (not guai protocol) help ANYone?

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by victoria, Nov 14, 2006.

  1. victoria

    victoria New Member

    I was talking to a friend at our local support group meeting, she told me that she had participated in a study that involved taking an MRI... as an aside, they told her she had fungal sinusitis because of the way it looked on the MRI (heavy metals will end up in fungus apparently)... she took guaifenesin only, not sure what the dosage was, but it got rid of it, permanently. She had tried many things, as I have.

    I plan on trying this... has anyone else here tried it? would love to hear some feedback. This is about only using the guai, not anything else in combination. I also looked on the net and found an article from not too long ago about it:

    ===============

    Guaifenesin & Sinusitis
    Townsend Letter for Doctors and Patients, Nov, 2005 by Jule Klotter

    Guaifenesin, an expectorant found in OTC cold medications like Robitussin, may be helpful for people with chronic sinusitis. An article by Wellington S. Tichenor, MD, refers to the Mayo Clinic findings that Major Basic Protein (MBP) found in the nasal mucus of people with chronic sinusitis injures the sinus lining, making the epithelium susceptible to bacterial infection.

    Major Basic Protein comes from activated eosinophils and kills common airborne fungi lodged in the airways. When openings from the sinus into the nasal passage become obstructed from inflammation, viruses, allergic rhinitis, foreign bodies, and polyps, mucus stagnates and MBP levels increase. In addition, less oxygen enters the sinuses, promoting bacterial overgrowth.

    Tichenor says, "Guaifenesin in high doses is often helpful in increasing clearance of secretions as well as thinning secretions. Efficacy has not clearly been proven, but most practitioners find that it is helpful."

    Mark Konlee of Keep Hope Alive reported in his Journal of Immunity (July-Sept. 2003) that upon taking 400 mg of guaifenesin twice daily and eliminating milk, cheese, and ice cream from his diet, he became "completely free" of sinusitis after many years of suffering.

    Information from the US National Library of Medicine reports that "guaifenesin appears to be effective in managing HIV-infected patients with symptomatic rhinosinusitis." The 23 patients in that study received 2400 mg/day of guaifenesin or a placebo for three weeks. Those in the guaifenesin group reported less nasal congestion and thinner postnasal drainage.

    Konlee says that the standard dose of guaifenesin in cold medicine is about 1200 mg per day, a dosage that appears to be safe for long-term use. He says guaifenesin has been taken at doses of 3600 mg daily without toxic effects. Tichenor says that guaifenesin can cause nausea and other GI problems and suggests beginning with a low dose and gradually increasing to an effective dose.

    As an aside, Konlee says that his internet search found that guaifenesin is helpful for people with fibromyalgia. He wonders if guaifenesin increases IgA mucosal levels.

    Konlee, Mark. Guaifenesin in the treatment of Fibromyalgia, HIV/AIDS, Chronic Fatigue Syndrome, sinusitis & respiratory infections. Journal of Immunity July-September 2003 (accessed www.keephope.net on 12 February 2004)

    Tichenor, Wellington S., MD. Sinusitis for Physicians. www.sinuses.com/md.thm (accessed 9 August 2005)

    US National Library of Medicine. Guaifenesin. www.aegis.com/pubs/drugs/69.html (accessed 9 August 2005)

  2. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    Back when I lived in CO, we suffered sinusitis every winter, along with asthma, bronchitis, and even pneumonia. We were prescribed Guai all the time. It is very effective in thinning mucus so that it can drain. Pathogens hide out in mucus and cause the infections.

    There is a very, very small group of people for whom salicylates will not block the Guai. I'm telling you this just in case you have a flare from the usually high dose, 2400 mgs. of Guai a day, for treating sinusitis. The off-label use for treating FMS while being sal-free is typically 600 mgs. If it were me, I'd start out slowly and build up to the large dose for thinning mucus.

    Good luck.

    Love, Mikie
  3. lrgatplay

    lrgatplay New Member

    Interesting that I found some of the Tussin brand of guaifenesin(only) at out local Dollar Tree store. Can't beat that price. Haven't tried it yet, but since had read about it here, I thought it might be useful for thinning nasal and other systemic mucus/thickening. My son presented with chronic sinus and allergy symptoms before getting to the West Nile diagnosis and CFS symptoms.
    It has 100mg per teaspoon but contains corn syrup and other stuff in the inactive ingredients.
    Do the health food stores have guaifenesin?
  4. elliespad

    elliespad Member

    Yes, I used to have chronic sinusitis for YEARS. Monthly antibiotics, decongestants. Daughter too. I (daughter too)used Guaifenesin 1200 mg. twice daily along with antibiotic. I can't even remember the last time I've had a sinus infection, maybe 5,6,7,8 years? That is also about the same time in my life that I got HEAVILY into supplements, so perhaps that plays into my being Sinusitis free. And throat infection free, and vaginal infection free, and ear infection free, and oh, I'm just grateful I don't get infections anymore, cause they used to be CONSTANT.

    But getting back to Guai, I thought it was pretty common knowledge that Guai does this, no?
    [This Message was Edited on 11/15/2006]
  5. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    Is sometimes used in women for fertility. It thins vaginal mucus, making it easier for sperm to make their way upstream. Pathogens can hide out in mucus in any part of the body and cause infections.

    Our bodies are designed to be on the move and when lymph nodes cannot drain or mucus becomes too thick to drain, we are vulnerable to infections.

    In fact, there are people, me included, who believe that the Guai Protocol for FMS works for additional reasons than just those theorized by Dr. St. Amand.

    Guai has few side effects and has been around forever. It's an old tried and true drug. It is sold here in both the long acting and fast acting forms. The cheapest I have found it is at Costco but it does contain the nasty blue dye. I got a rash when I first started the Guai with dye in it but it no longer seems to bother me.

    Guai can slightly thin blood as well as mucus. I did stop taking it several days prior to my surgery and for a couple of days afterward. My legs started to feel the old FMS pain and I got right back on it.

    Love, Mikie
  6. Kimba4318

    Kimba4318 New Member

    Well, the doc just prescribed this to me for crazy amounts of mucus in my ear. Sounds like it may have some other benefits too. I would love to have some help with the fibro as a side effect.

    Thanks for the info!

  7. victoria

    victoria New Member

    very interesting all of them.

    Yes Mikie, after reading your post especially, I will start out s/low! I don't need any reactions... even if I have to go off the benicar for a while from the MP, which I probably do, I really can't stand these headaches any more.

    AND lol, thanks for pointing out about the fertility for everybody - VERY interesting - and I am so glad that I personally don't have to worry about that anymore!

    Honestly this doesn't seem to be that well known? I have been to quite a few ENTs and infectious disease doctors trying to find an answer, nobody has given me guaifenesin, just the RX antihistamines like claritin etc, and the steroid nasal sprays which worked for a while but quit...

    We've talked about sinusitis before on this board, and while I've not reviewed them now in light of the guai info, my impression and foggy memory doesn't recall it being mentioned?... but wouldn't swear to it lol...

    Good point about the additives if you can't tolerate them, I don't know if the HF stores have it or what is in the guai they sell here? Might be worthwhile checking out - let us know if you do? ... I just bought the generic Walgreens brand.

    Hope anyone who tries this reports back... I will too!

    all the best,
    Victoria

  8. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    There is a lot more to the Guai Protocol for treating FMS than just taking the Guai. You also have to eliminate all salicylates from medications, supplements, and toiletries. Dr. St. Amand's book, "What Your Doctor May Not Tell You About Fibromyalgia," is an excellent read whether or not you decide to try the treatment.

    There is a group of us here in various stages of reversal of our FMS symptoms. I consider my FMS reversed. Unfortunatelly, I also have CFIDS and it's been much more challenging to treat.

    Victoria, that ship has sailed for me too :) but excess mucus can harbor pathogens which cause us ladies some problems. In all the time I was on the Doxy, I never had a problem with yeast. I'm sure the probiotics are partly responsible but the Guai may have made a difference too.

    Love, Mikie
  9. Yes Mikie is right, It is very effective in thinning mucus so that it can drain the sinuses. Even before I knew it helped fibro my dr gave it to me for my sinuses. But be careful the dosage is higher for sinus drainage, start slow and work up or you will flare big time.
  10. BHopeful

    BHopeful New Member

    my only concern is that it would dry out the mucous membranes. does that happen? That's why I don't take de-congestants - they totally dehydrate me.

    I would love to find something that thins the mucous without drying the membranes. Is Quai the answer???

    Hope so,
    Ben
  11. victoria

    victoria New Member

    that is all it is supposed to do is thin it... it is considered an expectorant, not an antihistamine...

    Let us know what happens. I am going to start tonight; hoping it doesn't have an adverse effect on sleep tho!

    all the best,
    Victoria

  12. Dee50

    Dee50 New Member

    Hi everyone, I'm on Guai started in March of this year. I'm very glad I did. It is helping me in many ways. I got tired of popping so many pills so nowdays I'm only taking Guai 600 x 2 and Ultram ER 100 x 2 daily. I'm feeling better than I have in a long time. I have a little taste of energy running thru my body. Sinus problems are gone in both nose,ears and throat. I am on the Guai Protocol. I will never stop taking the Guai. I know first hand that it is an awesome healing drug for me personaly.
    Take care,
    Dee50
  13. victoria

    victoria New Member

    just curious, did you notice how long it took to clear up your sinus problems?

    I've been taking it, 2 12-hour tabs 2X/day; it seems to be helping, but long-range is what will determine how successful this is, as I've gone periods before where it's been diminished.

    all the best,
    Victoria

  14. Catseye

    Catseye Member

    I got rid of all my sinus problems years ago by giving up dairy. I think it is the pasteurization process that alters the milk proteins and makes your immune system crazy. I had hay fever and cat allergies for 25 years that required all kinds of OTC meds. After about 2-3 months of no dairy, they were totally gone. I read later that raw milk may be okay and I started eating raw milk cheeses and had no problems. But when I got cfs really bad, I couldn't tolerate any dairy at all. karen
  15. victoria

    victoria New Member

    I've done different elimination diets many many times and was on a strict candida diet anyway for many years... 'no dairy' didn't work for this, etc... really I've exhausted almost everything, short of having surgery for no apparent reason seriously, have tried anything I hear about...

    I am just really hoping the guai over time will work for me, it is one thing that no doctor had ever mentioned, no matter whether it was the allergists, the ENTs or the infectious disease doctors.

    So, I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

    all the best,
    Victoria
  16. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    Talked to my daughter in Atlanta where I'm supposed to be but cannot. She said it's been really cold. Guess it must be for you too.

    I think docs get so involved with the pharmas and their reps that they forget about the old tried and true stuff. They, like many of the patients who watch TV, want to try all the "latest and greatest" stuff on the market.

    If one of the big pharmas advertised a new drug which would reverse the symptoms of FMS, people would flock to it even if they had to give up the sals. Yet, so few are willing to do the Guai protocol. It's the magic of advertising. My degree is in marketing and it's a fascinating area of study. It involves a lot of human behavior.

    I know you are looking at the Guai for other reasons. The docs will prescribe expensive sinus and asthma meds with the Guai as the active ingredient. It can be bought at Costco for slightly more than $5 for 220 of the 400 mg. tablets. It does have the blue dye and is the fast acting type. You can buy the white tablets here at ProHealth. They also sell the long acting Guai here.

    Good luck.

    Love, Mikie
  17. victoria

    victoria New Member

    It is SO true that docs forget about the old stuff even if it works well or even better than the new. We've recommended DMAE to friends who have had problems with ADHD but who don't want to take ritalin etc... DMAE is what was prescribed in the 1950s and is very safe, and helps many.

    Well, I've been buying generic Walgreens' guai, assuming all guai is made the same...

    I HAVE had the experience of getting something RX'd tho that is filled with generic but didn't work quite the same as the 'name-brand' stuff...

    wonder if that could be true with guai?

    It was quite nippy 2 days ago, but today ended up sunny and mild, and tomorrow happily is supposed to be almost 70 the last I heard. After this afternoon, I believe it!

    So sorry you couldn't make it up to see your daughter for Thanksgiving! I saw your post about your tooth, all my sympathy!!

    all the best,
    Victoria

  18. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    I had my feast yesterday and plan on spending today just watching TV and reading the newspaper. I'll be resting a lot until the root canal is done. With this infection and inflammation, on top of the infection and inflammation of the gb, my body needs its rest.

    I can't believe that stores are opening at 5:00 a.m. tomorrow. I guess for anyone who wants the bargains without the crowds, it's a good time to go. I never do the Black Friday thing. Too many people, too many flu bugs in the crowds. Bah! Humbug!

    I hope it does warm up for y'all. It's been cold down here, for us and I'm read for some warm weather. Take care.

    Love, Mikie
  19. victoria

    victoria New Member

    Consciously and subconsciously, lol, I think I'm happily married... if that worked, it would be a surprise. Altho I suppose I could be allergic to him?? hehehehe....

    Actually the only really major relief I had was on a 10-day cross-country trip in Feb from Phoenix to Santa Fe where I spent a few days in each place, then 45 minutes south of Chicago had a major headache start. I've wanted to repeat the trip lol to see if the same happened, but not had the chance... actually Santa Fe is reported to have the cleanest air!

    Mikie - I agree, I cannot deal with the crowds, I stay home...I probably won't venture into any store until Monday LOL;

    altho if I hadn't been cooking for family yesterday, I might've been drawn to checking out KMart and WalMart, they were open yesterday! I did go to some stores Wednesday night, they were totally vacant... probably the best time shopping, a lot of sales were already going on... even Michael's coupon this week was only good thru Wednesday!

    Hopeyou get your tooth cleared up sooner than it's scheduled for! That kind of infection can really affect you systemically without being obvious... happened to me at only 15 even.

    all the best,
    Victoria


    [This Message was Edited on 11/24/2006]
  20. victoria

    victoria New Member

    I would say the daily painful sinus headaches that drive me to distraction have been decreased on the surface by about 40%... very good imho! I've been taking the extended release tabs since about 11/19 or so, before only had the 4 hour tabs. My suggestion is that if anyone wants to try this, buy the 12 hour tabs immediately.

    I can tell when there is a sinus problem or not, even tho at times I am unaware of the pain or pressure in my face until later, because when there IS a problem, my shoulders have tender points that are non-existant when the sinusitis is not a problem at all... (I hope that makes sense, lol!)...

    I am still taking unisom, 1/2 tab to 1 tab per night, to help with sleep but it really is an antihistamine... I am planning on dropping this over the next week as I figure it cannot be of help with the sinus stuff. I want it to keep as 'loose' and draining as much as possible.

    BEN/bhopeful - the guai definitely does NOT have a drying effect at all; & I can feel the drainage down the back of my throat, altho no sore throat thankfully.

    all the best,
    Victoria