Some interesting laboratory findings.

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by matthewson, Dec 24, 2004.

  1. matthewson

    matthewson New Member

    Hi all. Just wanted to post about some interesting lab results that I have discovered. As some of you may know, I am a medical technologist working in a hospital lab. I had to have some routine lab work done for my primary doctor, So I had it drawn at my work-place and did some of it myself.

    I did my CBC myself and when I looked at the slide I had a lot of what we call viral lymphs. We see them alot when people have a viral infection. The weird part about it was I was not sick at all! My whole family had colds, but I did not catch it as usual. I have not had a cold since I developed this syndrome a year and 1/2 ago.

    My theory on this is, I had the same virus my family did, but because possibly my immune system is on overdrive from this DD, my body was clearing it out before it could produce the usual symptoms.

    I know that I responded in a previous post that I felt that this DD is a evolutionary mutation similar to sickle cell disease that was an evolutionary mutation against malaria, as sickleing of the red cells prevents the malarial parasite from entering them.

    Maybe we are evolutionarily more advanced than the general population!

    Just some Christmas morning musings! Hope everyone has a pain-free Christmas and New Year!

    Take care, Sally
  2. sofy

    sofy New Member

    My doc says I have an autoimmune response from having had the lyme vaccine. There is plenty of data to back this up and I had the genetic testing to prove that Im one of the population who this can happen too.

    When I read the post about ampligen and your post it sure ties that together.

    Ive been sick for several years and on ssd disability for 2 and I always say I the healthiest sick person I know. I never get a fever or a cold but I am suseptible to zombyism, pain and have a horrible case of the stupids.

    My doc has had some real good luck with gammagobulin drips and I think newsweek did a write up on it. That might be down the road for me but I scared of how the put this together. Lots of risks.
  3. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    This is fascinating. Perhaps we have evolved in a different manner than those who do not get these illnesses.

    I had posted some time back that it is possible that we are "normal" and that those who do not develop these illnesses are the ones with defective genes or a defective gene.

    A study was done on the descendents of those who did not develop the plage in Europe and it was found that they did have a defective gene. It protected them from getting sick when all around them were dying.

    The study was done because there is a man with HIV who isn't sick and has never developed AIDS. He has the same defective gene which kept some in Europe from getting the plague. If they can figure out how to use this info, it may be possible to keep those with HIV from getting full-blown AIDS.

    I believe that research into genetics and evolutionary development, especially in this polluted world, may yield some very interesting info regarding our illnesses. Thanks for sharing this. Are you going to be able to look at the blood of others with our illnesses? Most lab work is done automatically anymore and I think a lot is missed.

    Love, Mikie

  4. justlooking

    justlooking New Member

    I couldn't find your previous post or response about a mutant sickle cell theory. What was it posted under?

    I ask because when I "crash or flare" I feel sick down to every cell. It feels like it is on a cellular level. I have wondered if there was a sickle cell-like disease in caucasions (I'm caucasion). Though I've personally never heard of one I certainly, like you, have considered a possibility.

    Is there any evidence of this theory or is it just something you've stumbled upon and thought about because of the way this illness makes you feel deep down inside?

    Just curious because it sure sounds like a reasonable theory to me.

  5. Chermione

    Chermione New Member

    That is interesting to think about. I'm not a snob or anything like that and I've never said this to anyone for fear of being thought a freak, but I've always felt like I'm the type of person that is in the middle, or right on, in darn near everything! And if that is the case and having this syndrome is part of that then your theory makes sense to me.
  6. justjanelle

    justjanelle New Member

    in answer to your question of whether there is a sickle-cell-like condition in caucasians -- there is.

    There's a condition called "Thalasemia" which apparently is of Mediterranean origin (common in Italian/Greek/etc. and their decendants.) Like Sickle Cell it is a dominant trait and it causes misshapen blood cells. (I'm told they look rather "donut-like".) Like Sickle Cell, if you get it from only one parent you have a mild version and if you get it from both sides the results are very dangerous.

    This condition runs in my family. I lucked out and didn't get this one, but most of my brothers and sisters did. It's been traced back at least 4 generations to one of my dad's maternal ancestors.

    Best wishes,

    [This Message was Edited on 12/25/2004]
  7. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    Often have red blood cells which are plumped up and look like donuts. It is by living inside the cells and incorporating the body's DNA that mycoplasmas are able to fool the immune system and avoid detection.

    I believe stealth viruses operate in a similar manner.

    Love, Mikie
  8. matthewson

    matthewson New Member

    Just got back to the board today. Had 22 people at my house yesterday for Christmas and after they left I was hurting so bad that all I could do was go to bed!

    Still am in a lot of pain today, but we had such a great time yesterday that I guess it was worth it!

    Anyway, to answer some of your questions. I ran the CBC on myself and did what we call a differential which is counting the White blood cells into different catagories. I had an increased lymphocyte count and viral-looking lymphs. We see this in people who have an active virus. I do my own blood work from time to time and I have never had viral lymphs before in my differential. I was quite surprised to see them. We see them also in Mono. but the lymphs that show up in Mono. are very distinctive and look a lot worse that just a regular viral lymph.

    The fact that I have not had a cold or flu in the year and 1/2 that I have had this is just amazing to me!

    Justlooking, I am not sure where the post was where I talked about sickle cell disease, but essentially if you think about it, some of the symptoms such as joint pain are similar to FMS. The mechanism of sickle cell is totally different of course, but it is a mutation that makes a person less suseptable to malaria. As far as I know, sickle-cell disease only affects people with descendants from African countries.

    Mikie, I like your idea that we are the "normal" people! I think that could very well be true. I hadn't heard about the HIV-positive person who has not developed AIDS. I find it interesting that he has the same genetic makeup as the people who survived the plague. As to your other question, I have actually never seen a diagnosis of fibromyalgia on a patient's lab records, but if I see viral lymphs on a patient, I will try to look at the diagnosis and see if it may pertain to FMS.

    Sofy, that is interesting that you had an autoimmune response to the lyme vaccine. It may be a genetic thing why some people here can trace their FMS/CSF to a vaccine.

    Chermoine, I too always regarded myself as in the middle of everything also. I'm in the middle of the baby boom era, and seem to be a typical everything if you know what I mean!

    Jancahoon, we see slides of people with thalassemia once and awhile. Some people just have the trait which is called thalassemia minor and probably do not realize they have it, because I don't think it causes any symptoms, but the full-blown disease called thalassemia major causes severe hemolytic anemia with jaundice and enlarged spleen.
    The people who have this disease are usually of Mediterranean descent.

    I think that the science community will eventually find that there is some genetic link for people with this disease. Thank you all for your responses to my post.

    Take care, Sally

  9. justlooking

    justlooking New Member

    thanks for the very interesting information. I'm sure if I had the sickle-cell like disease you described and named (I forgot to write it down before replying...oops) it would have shown up on my blood work before. I just find the concept fascinating and logical.

    Thanks for adding some new ideas, information and theories that I can relate to on the board. I'm always excited when I see new things here!!! It gets my mind working again :)

  10. matthewson

    matthewson New Member

    Here's the discussion I said I would bump.


    Note: This post is from 2004, around Christmas time.[This Message was Edited on 01/01/2006]
  11. tansy

    tansy New Member

    These and CD4 and CD8 ratios were the measures used by local haematologists to Dx ME/CFS since the early 80s. When tested the term atypical lymphocytes would always appear on the results to describe what you have found, hence their belief ME/CFS is a post viral illness. For over 22 years all my blood tests indicated my body reacting to an infection, my macrophages were abnormal too (they're scavengers) + + +. I have the classic RBC signs too.

    I have no doubts over the genetic component in these DDs, in fact looking into those helped me considerably, on one side of my family these involved an overreactive IS that stays swtiched on. In my case I had some years during my childhood when I never developed symptoms from a virus but remained more susceptible to fungal and bacterial infections than most. That resistance to viruses changed following vaccines, the typhoid ones were the worst (1960s).

    What we often see here is not just symptoms from infections, but the IS reacting to pathogens long term and seemingly inefficently. Some of us are doing better through using immune modulators as against agents that stimulate the IS.

    Dr Gow's and Kerr's research last year picked up changed gene expressions indicating the IS is in overdrive in ME/CFS, this explains some of the classic symptoms including those related to raised cytokines.

    Happy New Year.

    love, Tansy[This Message was Edited on 01/01/2006]
  12. nanna4550

    nanna4550 New Member

    This is very interesting. I have not had a cold or flu for as long as I can remember(at least five years). Sometimes my lymph nodes on my neck swell up for a few days, but I never get the full blown version of any virus around (and believe me, my grandson has caught some good ones this last year from the kids at his daycare). It would be interesting to have the bloodwork checked, but if I'm not sick, why would my doc order it.
    Anyway, let us know if you find out any further information. Also, have you let the website researchers know of your findings??? This information might be of interest to them.
    Thank you and have a Happy New Year!
  13. Jeanette62

    Jeanette62 New Member

    I have always been puzzled why my lab tests came back for several months looking like I had an active infection going on when I wasn't sick and showed now signs of any type of infection. My WBC count was elevated and many other of the standard blood counts were elevated. My doctors still have no explanation for this.

    This all occurred when the FMS sx first hit me the hardest back between last Mar - Aug. I had a very mild cold virus in early Feb. for about 4 days and haven't had any since. Prior to that the last time I had been sick may have been Aug. or Sep. I use to have constant colds and allergy sx all the time in the years prior because I worked in a preschool with young children.
  14. elliespad

    elliespad Member

    There are THOUSANDS of people with HIV who don't have AIDS. Magic Johnson I just one example.