St. John's Wort or Sam-E; Need help!

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by mrpain, Jun 30, 2006.

  1. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    I have a family member who wants to get off zoloft. Which one of the natural mood changers which are all natural, would be the best choice to switch to?? St. John's Wort, or Sam-e??? How much should they take?? Any info would be very much appreciated...
    [This Message was Edited on 06/30/2006]
    [This Message was Edited on 06/30/2006]
  2. shootingstar

    shootingstar New Member

    I have no experience with Sam-e, but have taken Saint John's Wort. There is a big difference in brands -- I've taken several. I'm currently taking just 300 mg. of Target's house brand -- Origin, standardized to .3% hypercin -- to help with sleep, and at this time it is helping with sleep, no significant mood enhancement at that dose for me. That is a low dose for that brand.

    Dosage can vary, because brands are formulated different ways, so you'd have to read labels. I'd definitely recommend ramping up to any recommended dose. There aren't usually significant side effects, but you never know.
  3. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    I was just reading up on it by going to google, but it didn't really address my situation. The person I'm trying to help has OCD. (Obsessive, compulsive disorders). That was why I was asking the question...
  4. shootingstar

    shootingstar New Member

    They don't sell anything. It's a forum for people who want information on sjw, same-e, 5-htp etc. There is a lot of information in the archive section. The website was recently upgraded and all the old posts were archived. There might be information there. Hope this helps.
  5. ANNXYZ

    ANNXYZ New Member

    I hope YOU are having some better days yourself ( and do not forget the Igenex lyme test) .

    Something to consider is a book called "The Way Up From Down" that explains treating depression with amino acids . It is written by Priscilla Slagle , MD .
    If you google "The Way up From Down" you will find related info. Slagle has had success with patients w/ using
    L Tyrosine and Vit B6 ( must be together ) which are precursors for serotonin .

    The website gives more info . Also , another possibility for the anxiety OCD symptoms is GABA .

    Others here have posted about having success w/ amino
    acids and also with Sam E .

    good Luck, and I hope you are feeling better!
  6. hanna4175

    hanna4175 New Member

    i tried st johns wort a few years ago.. i felt horrible while taking it.. it was supposed to be for depression.. but i now am taking remeron.. ive been on it for over two years now.. and it is perfect!! talk to your doctor and see what other suggestions he or she may have for you.. sorry i wasn't of much help.. take care

    hanna
  7. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    I went out today and bought 2 boxes of SAMe for her to take. I also read where it would be good for me to start on it also as fibromyalgia patients were listed on this particular web site..

    Everything I have read claims it not only helps depression, but all kinds of mental problems, fatigue, pain, and even helps repair the liver.. So I may be starting on it soon also.. Thanks for the help!
  8. kbak

    kbak Member

    mrpain,
    Your family member should not use St john's wort or sam-e while taking any antidepressant, even getting off one. It's something to investigate after your system is clear of an antidepressant.

    Taking one of these natural mood regulators while on an antidepressant can cause dangerous side effects. Natural never means safe. I use natural remedies, but never without a lot of research and consultation with a naturopath.

    K.
  9. WendyC

    WendyC New Member

    so I wouldn't take it long term. Look into the B vitamins, magnesium and amino acids.

    wendyc
  10. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    Thank you hanginginthere, kbah, and wendyc!
    You all gave me something to think about. I'll try some of ya'll's advice....

    She came off of the antidepressants yesterday and we are going to start the SAM-e tomorrow. She's only been on the zoloft for a week...We will also try the magnesium and I'll check out the black cohosh...

    She's also taking tenex and risperdal which risperdal is a antiscycotic drug.. I just hope there's no bad reaction...
  11. MsE

    MsE New Member

    My youngest daughter uses Sam-E when she feels herself becoming too stressed and "down." She says it helps enormously.
    I have heard her say things like, "My life is going down the drain; time to get out the Sam-E." And she does.
  12. hopeful4

    hopeful4 New Member

    I've been using 400 mg. of SAMe/day for about 2 months. It was recommended by my doctor when I didn't want to take a prescription anti-depressant. It has helped my mood a lot. I use Jarrow brand.

    This may not apply to your family member, but St. John's Wort should not be used by someone taking tamoxifen for breast cancer.

    Always good to check on the drug interactions with herbals or nutriceuticals.
  13. cc0526

    cc0526 New Member

    Just want to reiterate what was said earlier... make sure your friend has stopped taking the zoloft for at least two weeks and have them under a doctor's supervision.

    Scary, but I had a nightmare this weekend. I have posted this on the regular board as well, so forgive me if you've read it already.

    This last Thurday my husband went in for surgery to have his gallbladder out. His liver function panal was through the roof. We knew the gallstones itself wouldn't make the labs that off. Anyway, long story short, he not only had dozens of stones, but a blockage of his bile duct as well. So after two surgeries and 4 days in the hospital, I wore myself out.

    Stupidly, I bought this little pack of "energy" vitamins that had a lot of ginsing in them. Never taken that before but I was desperate and wanted so much to be there for my husband for a change.

    A few hours later I was so dizzy and weak that I could hardly walk or wake up. The nurses at the hospital watched me for a while and I finally decided to go home and go to bed. I don't know how I got there (40 min drive) but I did. I immediately layed down. I couldn't sleep. My mind was just "not right". I got up and fell immediately to the floor. My legs were going wild, like restless legs on crack. I called my friend and mumbled I needed to go to the hospital and she said she'd be right over.

    She found me unconscious on my floor and my son screaming bloody murder. He is 5 and thought I was dead. I was rushed to the ER by ambulance.

    So what happened... the 3 little pills from the "energy pack" not only had ginsing but a couple other things including St. John's wort. I KNOW that is a big no no with other SSRI's but didn't read the lable well enough before I took them. I had a bad case of seritonin syndrome. I was very lucky that my friend is a nurse and brought my medications as well as the wrapper from the "energy pack".

    Long story, I know, but a huge wake up call for me to be more careful. I just never would have thought that there would be st. john's wort in energy (ginsing) pills.

    So now I'm still recoving. Totally exhausted and my nerves are still going crazy. I'm better though, but just one more stressor to add to my husbands surgeries and my CFIDS.... and I'm supposed to work a half shift tomorrow.

    Patty
  14. hugs4evry1

    hugs4evry1 New Member

    You can also do some research here at the Pro Health store.

    One thing I thought of was to try to treat more at a basic level, not just symptomatic.

    5HTP is another recommendation though. Hubby's on it, he wasn't doing well on Effexor.

    I learned so much from doing research here at the store. Now I wish my brain could remember it better!!! (Sorry, just woke up and haven't even finished my coffee)

    Hugs,

    Nancy
  15. butterfly8

    butterfly8 New Member

    I have come off Luvox ( an antidepressant) because I had become physically addicted to it and needed to keep increasing the dosage. I am now off it and taking SAMe - which I am very happy with.

    However, it took over 18 months of gradually reducing the dose before I was fully "clear" of that antidepressant. And it was a bit of a bumpy trot - but definitely worth it in the long term.
  16. Diagoras

    Diagoras New Member

    I have tried St. Johns Wort and thyme. Thyme tastes really good on salad and most other food, but it doesn't do squat for depression and neither does St. Johns Wort. There are many wonderful, very effective antidepressants available. If Zoloft isn't working or has too many side effects, there are dozens of others he or she can try. If your family member is insistent on getting off medication, then maybe you can suggest therapy? But I suspect medication would work better.
  17. shootingstar

    shootingstar New Member

    St. John's Wort has helped many people with depression. I have very severe depression at times, a suicide attempt, have taken innumerable antidepressants and combinations of antidepressant with other prescription medications. I'm doubtful sjw would help much with obsessive compulsive disorder, but don't know.

    St. John's Wort has helped me, on occasion, nearly as much as any prescription antidepressant I have taken, more than most. Like all other antidepressants have done with me, it quit working over time.

    Individuals react differently to antidepressants. St. Johns Wort will help some, not help others. It takes time to kick in, varies immensely from brand to brand, comes in several formulations, and may be inconsistent even within brands. I am very careful when I take it, both ramping up or down if changing dosage, not exceeding recommended dosage, being very aware of any side effects. There are several drugs with which it should not be taken, and no one should take it without researching it carefully.
    [This Message was Edited on 07/03/2006]
    [This Message was Edited on 07/03/2006]
  18. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    Thanks to MsE, hanginginthere, cc0526, brooksiemom, butterfly8, DIAGORAS, & shootingstar, ya'll are awesome!

    My family member is my teenage daughter who has obsessive compulsive disorder and tourretts syndrome. She must have gotten it from me although mine wasn't as bad, nor is it now.

    But I am fighting with fibro and cfs....and sleep apnea..
    But she went off her zoloft after being on it a week, and took her first SAM-e today along with vit. B complex and magnesium...She also takes tenex and risperdal for the OCD & tourretts..

    She's a straight A student and does well in life except for her condition.. That's why I want to do all I can to help her find a better way to endure. Thanks for the help and I'll let you know the results from the SAM-e..

    I've just started on St John's wort myself and will probably switch to the SAM-e soon because of all the research I've been reading about on the SAM-e and how it is suppose to be good for fibro sufferers...
  19. mrpain

    mrpain New Member

    Your a sweet and thoughtful lady.. How did you run across the black kohosh?? The web site I just read said it was good for hot flashes in women and it helped their cycle.. Since my brainfog is thick tonight, I just stopped reading at that point..