Still Herxing on Olive Leaf Extract?

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by erica741, Jul 2, 2008.

  1. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    Update on 8/25:
    Help, I'm still sick! Almost 2 months after starting the olive leaf extract, I'm still severely exhausted, running fevers, and live each day in a daze. When I saw my doctor a month ago, he was pleased that I was herxing on the olive leaf extract. But 2 months seems like an awfully long time to still be herxing, plus I've gotten worse.

    My doctor is impossible to talk to between appointments, and I'm not scheduled to see him for another 3 weeks.

    I'm thinking I should reduce my dosage. 2,700 mg a day seems awfully high!

    Also Dr. Montoya took me off Valtrex in March due to me having this same reaction. I only took 500 mg of Valtrex a day for 3 weeks before he and my primary MD talked and decided I should stop taking it.

    What's interesting is that I tolerated Valcyte much better than the olive leaf extract and Valtrex. On Valcyte I was really sick for less than 2 months before starting to get better. I also had ups and downs on Valcyte, whereas the olive leaf extract is one humungous low....rock bottom really. :-(


    Original post on 7/2:
    I started olive leaf extract for my EBV yesterday morning. My doctor has me on 1350 mg 2x a day.

    I took 1350 mg yesterday and only 450mg so far today (I initally misread my MD's dosing instructions and thought I was supposed to take 450 mg 3x a day, instead of 3 450 mg capsules twice a day).

    I've felt pretty good for the past week, and felt ok when I first woke up today. But within an hour of waking, I started to feel really exhausted and "out of it", and have been going downhill all day. This sudden exhausted feeling and pattern of getting worse as the day progresses (usually I feel much better as soon as I eat, drink some tea, and definitely after taking a Provigil) is similar to how I've felt before at the beginning of a herx.

    I guess what I'm wondering is if anyone thinks I could be herxing from the olive leaf extract, especially so quickly?

    Since I've been on antibiotics for 2 months, I wonder if starting the olive leaf extract yesterday is coincidence, and that I'm actually having another round herxing from the abx?

    Thanks for your help!


    [This Message was Edited on 08/25/2008]
  2. kbak

    kbak Member

    Hi Erica,
    I only use olive leaf when I'm coming down with something. It's very effective but also nails me which is why I don't take it everyday. Olive leaf is certainly recommeded for CFS but I have a hard time taking it. I can't stand to feel alful, no matter how effective something is.

    Take care,
  3. place

    place New Member

    I would get cold sores for months on end. If not all the time. I take it daily and I have not had a cold sore for a year!
  4. Slayadragon

    Slayadragon New Member

    I certainly wouldn't doubt it.

    I've not heard of a lot of CFS sufferers using Provigil successfully, though for a while my psychopharmacologist was absolutely sure he was going to fix me up on it. The first time I used it, I felt totally like my old self. I never got it back after that.

    How has it been for you?

    PITATOO Member

    Olive leaf extract is very potent. I would lower my dose. If you have/had candida it works well but you could be feeling die off. It is a wonder herb but it will make you feel exhausted if there is an actual organism it is fighting off. Being on antibiotics for 2 months could cause a candida infection, that alone will decrease your energy.
  6. efly

    efly New Member

    I crashed on 12 drops.......... some bodies are very sensitive to any little thing.
  7. Honora88

    Honora88 Member

    But I definitely felt a lot better after herxing
  8. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    My dad did some research on olive leaf extract online last night, and everything he came across said a herx reaction is common, especially on higher doses. I'm taking 6 capsules a day!

    I also learned (and as pitatoo mentioned) that olive leaf extract is not only an antiviral, but also an antibiotic, antifungal, anticandida, and maybe more.

    Since I not only have high EBV, but also am taking the antibiotics for lyme and babesia (and may have developed some mild candida in the past few months), it is no wonder I am feeling so bad! I'm probably herxing from multiple sources.

    I definitely feel like I'm herxing because after I posted yesterday, I developed a low-grade fever which has continued for the past 24 hours.

    Interestingly, when I talked to my LLMD's nurse today, she told me the doctor didn't think I could herx from the olive leaf extract. I think there may have been some miscommunication, because I can't imagine why he would say that?

    Thanks again for the info!

    [This Message was Edited on 07/03/2008]
  9. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    Hi Lisa, I've been taking 100 mg of Provigil almost daily since mid-March. It worked really well for months, but I feel lately that it is losing it's effectiveness. Upping to 200 mg doesn't increase my alertness too much, and gives me a wicked hangover.

    However, I have been herxing almost continuously since early May, since my LLMD put me on abx, then changed my abx, and then started me on chlorella, and now olive leaf extract. I've herxed majorly (comparable to Valcyte) each time.

    So, I guess what I mean to say is that in general, the Provigil works well for me, but it only works if I am already at a certain level of energy. Like if I'm at 50-60%, it will take me to 75-80%. But on the days I'm herxing or just really exhausted, the Provigil has zero effect on me.

    Since I know you've improved a lot in the past few months since fixing your mold issue, you might want to give the Provigil another try? If you are feeling "ok" but could use some more alertness and mental stamina, the Provigil might work for you now.

    If you try it again, let me know how it works!

    [This Message was Edited on 07/03/2008]
  10. Leaknits

    Leaknits New Member


    My first go-round with OLE, about 3 years ago but I don't remember exactly, I combined 450mg per day OLE, 900mg Cat's Claw Extract, 20 drops Pau d'Arco.

    I felt so much better and very quickly that I recall Whoopee-ing that if I hadn't known my body was sick with CFS I wouldn't have thought I had a problem at all.

    For some forgotten reason I stopped taking the Big Three mentioned above.
    Restarted months after stopping and it seems something in my body had changed because I couldn't tolerate the combo.

    It was so bizarre to feel agitated and sort of wired from what had seemed to help me before...I regret I had to stay away from the extracts and Pau d'Arco...and I couldn't persuade myself to just restart with one of the helpers and see how I did, then add a second one to see if maybe that one was what caused the odd feelings and, last but not least, re-add the Pau d'Arco.

    I'm hoping to get my courage back up and sloooowly do a restart.

    So, bottom line, yes I guess one could herx due to OLE.

    BUT: I don't know what antibiotic you have been using for the two months you mention nor whether it might be causing any odd reaction when combined with OLE.

    Anybody else have this sort of reaction?

  11. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    See update above.
  12. simonedb

    simonedb Member

    I would be careful taking chlorella if you have mercury in you. I was advised by a topnotch scientist who wrote a book about children and pollution not to use after I mistakenly allowed myself to have tetanus/dpt shot that I later found out had mercury, aluminum etc in it last year. She said the chlorella could just re-expose me to the mercury in an acute way, better to let my body deal with it.

    I felt awful every time I took chlorella, headaches, gross etc
  13. slowdreamer

    slowdreamer New Member

    Just wanted to report that my response and use of this extract is about the same as KBAK..Is it a reaction or a herx I don't know..I beliebve it knocks off a virus in the early stages but I only have a couple of doses and then a few drops..

    I would love someone to research this.
    Yhey have good research results using OLE for Hepatitis I believe.?
  14. tennisnut

    tennisnut New Member

    Can you please define "herx" "herxing" for me. Is that a real word??
  15. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    Herxheimer reaction
    From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    The Herxheimer reaction (also known as Jarisch-Herxheimer or herx) occurs when large quantities of toxins are released into the body as bacteria (typically Spirochetal bacteria) die, due to antibiotic treatment.

    Typically the death of these bacteria and the associated release of endotoxins occurs faster than the body can remove the toxins via the natural detoxification process performed by the kidneys and liver. It is manifested by fever, chills, headache, myalgia (muscle pain), and exacerbation of skin lesions. Duration in syphilis is normally only a few hours but can be much longer in other diseases. The intensity of the reaction reflects the intensity of inflammation present.

    The Herxheimer reaction has shown an increase in inflammatory cytokines during the period of exacerbation, including tumor necrosis factor alpha, interleukin-6 and interleukin-8.[1][2]

    My translation: Feeling worse after starting a new antibiotic, antiviral, etc due to the die-off of the pathogens. You feel sick because the body's detox system can't keep up with the volume of pathogens being released into the blood stream.

    If someone can explain better, please do!

    [This Message was Edited on 08/26/2008]
  16. tennisnut

    tennisnut New Member

    for the Herx definition. There must be so much guesswork in taking anything for this condition. I am going to start keeping a log again to make it easier to follow symptoms.

    I have had poor reactions from so many sources, including Vitamin B, Vitamin D3, Magnesium, Melatonin, Astralagus, Potassium and Selenium and probably others forgotten. They make me feel bad almost immediately, so in most cases I have stopped straight away, or given a couple of days.

    I was going to try OLE, but am having second thoughts. I also get tired of wasting the money.

    I understand how you get frustrated with needing professional advice. I think we have to be our own doctor so much of the time and there's no support there.

    Good luck, TN
  17. erica741

    erica741 New Member

    To give you an idea of what OLE did to me:

    I already mentioned I started it on 7/1. I've been reducing my dosage the past few days, and today was the first day I was able to leave the house in months.

    So people have been talking about Labor Day coming up and I've been so confused because I thought it was still July.

    Today I was able to think straight for the first time in about 2 months, and I was like "OMG, its almost Labor Day!. What happened to the summer?" I literally have been in such a fog that I have no recollection of the past 2 months.

    I don't care if herxing is supposed to be good for you..being that "out of it" is just not good.

    I wonder if it is doing something to my blood pressure? My mom has a blood pressure machine here, so I should have her take mine.

    (I don't remember saying anything about blood sugar. Actually if anything, I feel worse after eating cause I guess there's even less blood flow to my head).

    Thanks for your advice about high doses on OLE with CFS...I didn't know that!

  18. redhummingbird

    redhummingbird New Member


    I'm sorry to hear about how badly you've been feeling. I think you did the right thing about cutting back on OLE.

    I don't think detoxing as hard as you have for so long is good for your body.

    It drives me crazy that you can't get a phone call from your doctor!

    I'm glad you were able to get out of the house.

    Hang in there! I owe you an email. Thanks for your support...
  19. WestyWoman

    WestyWoman Member

    Hi friends. New to the forum. Any responses are appreciated.

    Can someone please describe their herxing experiences, especially the bad ones? Please post soon before I die over here.....

    Taking 2 caps 3X/day of Olive Leaf Extract for the past 5 1/2 days for EBV. Shoot me now. Or will the herxing, if that's what's going on, just kill me if I continue.