Systemic enzymes for fibro pain anyone?

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by mbofov, May 11, 2011.

  1. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    I've been reading about systemic enzymes as a possible remedy or partial help for post-exertional malaise. I have CFS, no fibro. I will be starting the enzymes soon.

    But along the way I've been reading how they help some people with fibro pain.

    I've read that it's important to take them on an empty stomach - if taken with food, they'll just help your digestion, but on an empty stomach they act differently, help reduce inflammation and dissolve fibrin.

    I've also read that enteric-coating helps them pass through your stomach to the small intestine where they are then absorbed into the blood stream.

    Also, I see where they can cost anywhere from around $20 to over $100 - amazing price differential!

    Anyways, I just wanted to see if any of you had tried these or even thought of them for pain. And they may help with arthritis too.

  2. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    It will be a little while before I start the enzymes, but will post how I do.

    I've also read about proteolytic enzymes, I think they're very similar to the systemic ones or maybe the same thing.

    Anyways, I hope you get some relief soon!

  3. quanked

    quanked Member

    I found this interesting article about this topic after reading your post. I did not know there was an alternative to using NSAIDs. I am seriously interested in this. I have been taking celebrex for probably 10 years now. It worries me.


    Systemic Enzyme Therapy for Pain
  4. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    I took Nattokinase plus vitamin E for fibrin overgrowth in the bloodstream. It actually works better than Heparin. I took it on an empty stomach. I didn't take it for pain but who knows, it make have helped with that too.

    Love, Mikie
  5. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    Quanked - I hope the enzymes help you. There have been discussions in the past on this board about these enzymes for both fibro and CFS. Someone did post a year or two ago how it helped them with energy (they had CFS). Anyways, good luck!


  6. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    I'm really glad to hear the nattokinase and vit. E helped with fibrin overgrowth - I think the fibrin overgrowth can be a source of pain for FM. And if it helps with inflammation, that's an extra plus. Anyways, it's nice to hear that something actually works!

  7. kellygirl

    kellygirl Member always, check with your doctor if you are on any medication. Enzyme supplements can cause pain if you have anything like colitis.

    but, yeah, they are great, esp. for sluggish bowels.

    Since I can't swallow capsules very well, I open the capsule and pour it on my food.
  8. Mikie

    Mikie Moderator

    This is common in people with chronic infections. The little critters thrive in a low-oxygen environment and some believe they can actually manipulate our bodies to increase the fibrin. Platelets are caught up in the fibrin, giving the pathogens a place to hide out. As drugs or enzymes cause the fibrin to break up, the pathogens are dumped into the bloodstream. This usually wakes up the immune system which goes on a killing spree. If there is a large dieoff of pathogens, one can have strong Herx-like purging with nausea, diarrhea and profuse sweating. A headache often preceeds a Herx.

    As for pain, I would assume that if there is less oxygen in the bloodstream, our limbs are not getting the oxygen they need. Periferal neuropathy is another possible source of pain, tingling and numbness from lack of circulation.

    I did research and found articles which cited studies in which the Nattokinase was more effective than Heparin in dealing with fibrin. Judging from my Herxing, I would tend to agree. Also, my sed rate rose to a more normal level.

    Love, Mikie
  9. quanked

    quanked Member

    Yesterday I saw my doctor and she gave me the results of my liver ultrasound I had done. No abnormalities could bee seen in my liver or gall bladder. I have a small cyst on my liver that does not concern her.

    So she said I need more liver tests. We discussed the fact that I have been on Celebrex for about 10 years and it might be a factor. So, she has asked me to stop taking Celebrex for 2 weeks and then have my blood drawn for testing. While I was there I showed her info on systemic enzyme therapy and asked her if there was any reason why I should not give it a try. She researched it while I was there and she did not see any reason why not. And I thought this might be a good time to give this therapy a try.

    The problem is I have not found any info on dosing or what brands might be more useful than others. I want to order some today if I can.

    Anyone on the board have any ideas or recommendations on these issues?

    Thanks in advance for any and all responses.
  10. quanked

    quanked Member

  11. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    First, here's a link to another thread on this board about syst. enzymes which has some recommendations:

    I can't recommend anything first-hand, although I think this product looks interesting and has a good price:

    It's not enteric-coated. I have read that enteric coating is important to prevent digestion in the stomach, and then someone else said if you take it on an empty stomach it won't be digested there. I don't know.

    If I were you, I would do a separate post with your specific questions as this thread probably won't get many more hits. Also, do a bit more research on posts on this board, I think you'll find more info.

    Good luck!

  12. quanked

    quanked Member

    Thanks for your responses. I think you are right mbofov--I need to start a thread.

    Jam, I searched for the 2 products you mention on both NOW foods and Swansons. I am more confused than ever. I will give NOW a call.

    Thanks again--this gives me a starting point.

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