Very interesting article re molybdenum pantethine

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by mbofov, Sep 13, 2007.

  1. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    First, thanks to woofmom for triggering for me at least a renewed interest in molybdenum and pantethine. Last year I had a very hard time taking chlorella due to detox symptoms, but then found when I added molybdenum (150 mcg. three times a day, total 450 mcg. a day), I was able to up my dose quite a bit. I had literally forgotten that molybdenum did that for me, and only remembered when I came across a letter I had written to my doctor asking him if it was okay to take that much molybdenum. He responded that it was okay.

    I eventually stopped taking the chlorella because I kept getting sick on it, but that's another story.

    Anyways, here's an article I had stored on my computer - I don't know where I got it from or who wrote it, but it's about both molybdenum and panethine, and it's very interesting:

    The Candida/Aldehyde detox pathway and the Molybdenum Connection

    As it relates to Candida, those of you who have read the work of Dr. Orion Truss, or who have seen quotes by others from his work, will already have been alerted to his assertion that much of the harm done by Candida results from its waste product, acetaldehyde, which in turn can affect the metabolic, neurological, endocrine, and immune systems. Further, that few chemicals can create so much havoc in the body as acetaldehyde can. It may interfere with the receptors for acetylcholine which is supposedly the major neurotransmitter in the corpus callosum.

    Formaldehyde, obviously then, is related to acetaldehyde in the aldehyde chain of chemicals.

    Dr. Stephen Rochlitz worked with cross-crawl brain integration exercises with dyslexic patients with formaldehyde taped to these patients right brain hemisphere, and sometimes the left.

    Acetaldehyde is a fungal waste product.

    Dr. Stephen Cooter, in his book "Beating Chronic Disease", ProMotion Publishing, San Diego, California, states that "Candida is responsible for flooding the system with an accumulation of toxic acetaldehydes. Acetaldehydes are known to poison tissues -- accumulating in the brain, spinal cord, joints, muscles and tissues."

    Dr. Cooter then goes on to describe how he learned from a chiropractor, Dr. Carol Cooper [this name came up on this List way back] that molybdenum -- a mineral -- not a medication, but a nutrient, had a blanket reputation for breaking down yeast by-products into forms that the body could excrete. Coincidentally, Dr. Cooter read the monogram by Dr. Walter Schmitt "Molybdenum for Candida Albicans Patients and Other Problems" through Dr. Cooper. [Interestingly, these are all chiropractor, Drs. Roschlitz, Cooper, and Schmitt.]

    I'm beginning to see a glimmer of some possible connections here. Dr. Roschlitz's work, and Dr. Walter Schmitt's, although slightly different, seems similar to me to the principle of Dr. Nambupridad's work with NAET, and perhaps then, holding the substance, when the body is worked on through one of their modalities, might not seem so strange after all. I think I see a common denominator here. Worth exploring? Perhaps....

    Back to Dr. Cooter and Dr. Schmitt: "Molybdenum is chemically responsible for breaking down acetaldehyde into acetic acid. Acetaldehyde cannot be excreted from the body; it accumulates. Acetic acid can be, though, and the body naturally removes it or changes it into acetyl coenzyme A, a major player in the body's energy system.... Acetaldhyde accumulations in tissue are responsible for weakness in muscles, irritation, and PAIN."

    And now for the good part (g), directly quoted from Dr. Walter Schmitt:

    "Chemical aldehydes are best known as fragrances." [Shall I repeat that?] "Chemical aldehydess are best known as fragrances.... Ethanol, or drinking alcohol, is also precessed to acetaldehyde. ...the body has an enzyme which breaks down the aldehydes to less toxic substances. This enzyme is aldehyde oxidase, or sometimes, aldehyde dehydrogenase. Aldehydes encountered dietarily or environmentally or produced in the body must be handled by aldehyde oxidase metabolic pathways.

    Acetaldehyde is a particularly toxic substance which, in addition to being produced by threonine and ethanol, is a product of the metabolism (i.e. fermentation) of carbohydrate in yeast -- hence the Candida connection. Acetaldehyde is thought to be the major source of tissue damage in alcoholics rather than ethanol itself. The conversion of acetaldehyde into acetic acid" for this reaction to occur, threonine to acetaldehyde to acetic acid to acetyl coenzyme A, NAD (niacine amide) is required, and aldehyde oxidase is dependent on riboflavin, iron, and molybdenum. These forgoing nutrients could be helpful to Candida albicans patients, and others who are sensitive to various fragrances and airborne odors. Those patients with aldehyde sensitivity are incredibly sensitive to any type of fragrance.

    By coincidence, (or is it?) there's a little squibb in the newsletter from the Environmental Health Association of Dallas on fragrance. "Perfume today is not made from flowers but from toxic chemicals..... More than 4,000 chemicals are used in fragrances. Of these, 95 percent are made from petroleum. Some toxic chemicals found in fragrances: toluene, ethanol, acetone, formaldehyde, limonene, benzene derivatives, methylene chloride, and many others known to cause cancer, birth defects, infertility, nervous system damage, or other injuries.... Exposure to scented products can cause exhaustion, weakness, 'hay fever', dizziness, difficulty concentrating, headaches, rashes, swollen lymph glands, muscle aches and spasms, heart palpitations, nausea, stomach cramps, vomiting, asthma attacks, neuromotor dysfunction, seizures, and loss of consciousness." This was reprinted from No Perfume Means Healthier Air brochure, Breath of Fresh Air Battleaxe, Oakland, California.

    And from another source comes another connection -- from Dr. Robert Atkins' newsletter: Dr. Atkins is writing about Pantethine which he prescribes to his Crohn's Disease and Colitis patients, with acknowledgment to Dr. Melvin Werbach for Dr. Werbach's study that demonstrated that people with colitis have markedly decreased Coenzyme A activity if the mucosal surface of their colons, even when the blood levels of pantothenic acid are normal. Dr. Atkins concluded, based on his success with these patients of his, that Pantethine bypasses the block in converting Vitamin B5 (Pantothenic Acid) to Coenzyme A. But also, that Pantethine is a growth factor for lactobacillus bulgaricus and bifidobacterium that we know help control yeast overgrowth (and Dr. Cooter also speaks of it in his book). Candida, according to antibody studies done at the Atkins Center, is involved in more than 80 percent of all cases of Crohn's and Colitis.

    And for autoimmune problems, Dr. Atkins states, " For all conditions that a doctor might prescribe prednisone -- allergies, asthma, rheumatoid arthritis, psoriasis, lupus, and olther autoimmune diseases, pantethine can be safely, effectively substituted. I routinely use it for all of those conditions on hundreds of my patients, and it's valuable in weaning them off steroidal drugs, or certainly in allowing a lower dose....

    By upping body levels of a body enzyme, pantethine counteracts brain fog, certain allergic sensitivities, and some consequences of alcoholism. (And here it is --) ... In people with candidiasis, the enzyme fights off a toxic byproduct called acetaldehyde, which is thought to cause brain fog, often-suffered but rarely diagnosed.... Acetaldehyde also is suspected of being responsible for some symptoms of alcoholism, including alcoholic heart muscle disease. The pantethine-stimulated enzyme also detoxifies formaldehyde, an all too frequent offender for chemically sensitive individuals."

    In summary, Dr. Atkins is saying that Pantethine, without toxic consequences, can reduce cholesterol, counteract oxidation, stimulate the growth of friendly bacteria, and fight allergies, inflammation, autoimmune disruptions, and alcoholism. In case you wondered, Dr. Cooter and Dr. Schmtt suggest 300 micrograms of Molybdenum in three divided doses per day, and further suggests staying on it for at least 4 months.. Dr. Atkins suggests 450 to 900 milligrams daily of Pantethine with an equal amount of Pantethenic Acid [think this should be pantothenic acid, not pantethenic]

  2. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    I've ordered pantethine too, for the first time. Also am interested to see what it can do for my high cholesterol --

  3. morningsonshine

    morningsonshine New Member

    Where are people getting this supplement?? I can't find it separate, and how much is needed??

  4. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

    I got my Molybdenum from Holistic Heal as part of the Methylation Cycle Block protocol. Pantethine can be purchased through Prohealth. But, before you decide to use them, please research aldehydes thoroughly, both here and on the web. Everytime I read about them I seem to learn a little more.
  5. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    I buy molydenum from House of Nutrition on-line, Douglas Lab's brand. I take two 250 mcg. tabs a day. I cleared this amount with my doctor, who said it was okay.

  6. morningsonshine

    morningsonshine New Member

    Thank you for sharing this information.

    I had started the methlation protocol with the first 4 simple suggestions. But my pain kept increasing, so i thought maybe i need the Moly.

    Now reading more it confirms this, i'm not the greatest researcher, i know some people love it, but i find i lose my patients with it all.

    And trying to get my head around it.

    I know i'm gluten intolerance which would probably and have alcoholic in the family with would probably play into this whole chemical process and candidas thing with the acetaldehyde .
    My Grandma was an alcoholic and after she quit, i believe was probably still what one would call a dry alcholic, same with my father.

    I think the body was producing alcohol all on its own.
    I don't know if this is all making sence, just know it all ties intogether some how.

    i will try to be a good girl and research acetaldehyde more. But i know i want to try the moly, but couldn't find it separate will go back to the sight i bought my methylation products from.
  7. deliarose

    deliarose New Member

    I like it. I was taking the pills, and switched to the liquid form. You can get it lots of places, yasko, elyte, etcc.

    Also take e-lyte's panthothenic acid.
    Seems to agree with me too.

  8. morningsonshine

    morningsonshine New Member

    for adding your post Deliarose, and jamin health. I'll be looking up these products and making a purchase of these supplements.

    Right now i'm trying to add CoQ10 to my supplements. I'm emailing this post to myself so i don't lose it.

    [This Message was Edited on 01/24/2008]
  9. tansy

    tansy New Member

    the most popular source, amongst those i know, is Biocare's Nutrisorb Molybdenum (liquid).

  10. SherylD

    SherylD Guest

    marking to read later...

    Thanks for bumping!
  11. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

    They got it right except they should have also focused on xanthine oxidase. Xanthine Oxidase uses the same pathway and also requires Molybdenum as a cofactor. Phenols are xanthines. Phenols are also fragrances. And if the body has a hard time dealing with phenols because of incorrect utilization or metabolism of sulfur the results can be the same as or mimic a yeast infection.
  12. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

    Homogenized dairy products contain Xanthine Oxidase which further depletes Molybdenum
  13. jennbug

    jennbug New Member

    Can someone please tell me the difference between the two. Is one truly better than the other? As I understand they are both vitamin b5. Thank you jenn.
  14. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

    I'm still researching this. But phenolic compounds may interfere with the conversion of pantothenic acid to pantethine. Phenolic compounds are nerve deadening agents.
  15. Catseye

    Catseye Member

    The liver has to convert many vitamins into forms the body can use. Pantothenic acid is B5. The liver converts panthothenic acid to pantethine. It helps me enormously to take things that are "body ready" rather than depending on my digestive system to convert them.

    Similarly, folic acid (vitamin B9) is converted to folate. One way the methylation protocol is attempting to assist the body by providing the already converted form of folic acid. Also, the multi recommended in it has retinyl palmitate, the converted form of vitamin A. Large amounts of retinyl palmitate are hard on the liver, BTW. That's why people with liver problems can't eat raw seafood like oysters, because they are loaded with it.

    Some other bioactive forms of B vitamins:

    B1 - thiamin mononitrate
    B2 - riboflavin 5 phosphate
    B3 - niacinamide
    B6 - pyridoxine 5 phosphate (aka p5p)
    B7 - biotin
    B12 - methylcobalamin

    I take all of these in a special B complex vitamin.

    I think it helps so much to take bioactive forms of vitamins because our digestive systems, including our livers, aren't functioning properly. Anything you do to help this system along helps everything. I take also betaine hcl and digestive enzymes to help mine along, along with bioactive forms of vitamins.

    best wishes

    [This Message was Edited on 03/02/2008]
  16. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

  17. woofmom

    woofmom New Member

    Yeast, fungus and mold play a much bigger role in illness than most realize. Yeast, fungus or mold gain a foothold and grow out of control because of a weakened or altered immune system.
  18. mbofov

    mbofov Active Member

    Karen - thanks for all the info re the bioactive forms of B vitamins. I just got in an order of pantethine. I had ordered one bottle before, took only one softgel a day, and called it quits. After reading more about it, realize I need probably 900 mg. (3 softgels a day). This is for high cholesterol as well as yeast problems.

    And thanks to you, woofmom, for your continual bumping. It's made me take another look at something I had forgotten about or never really absorbed when reading.

  19. Diva55

    Diva55 New Member

    Thanks Mary for posting this very interesting info - I've only just noticed this thread.

    So annoying that so much great info gets "lost" amongst all the stuff that should be on chit chat!

    also thanks to Karen for the info on activated forms of vitamins.

    Best wishes
    [This Message was Edited on 03/23/2008]
  20. inbetweendays

    inbetweendays New Member

    doesn't the b5 feed candida? i am confused