Wessely and Reeves

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by quilp, Oct 9, 2009.

  1. quilp

    quilp New Member

    I suspect these two can look forward to many sleepless nights in the coming weeks. I am worried about their health, especially Wessely; he's not getting any younger. I wonder how he feels right now ?

    His career ? I don't really care, but I hope he leaves Kings College London in a hurry and in handcuffs. He has blood on his hands irrespective of what transpires. If this news really is for real, how could this man carry on in any capacity ? He's still trying to link childhood trauma as a cause of ME. How desperate can one man be ? His whole life's work has been premised on ME being an illness that sufferers are perpetuating because of their 'abnormal illness beliefs'.

    How can anyone be so wrong, in such a big way, with such devastating consequences, and still function as a human being ? How can you measure the suffering he has inflicted ? How many have committed suicide because of his directives ?

    Turn the other cheek, forgive thy neighbour.......you know the rest; but for this man, oh let his eyes see into the eyes of millions, the eyes of tortured souls crying out for redemption.

    Is this man, mad or bad, evil or crazy ? I don't know, and i really don't care anymore.

    Kind regards, Mark

  2. Bluebottle

    Bluebottle New Member

    Let's not forget their partners in crime, Peter White, Michael Sharpe, Trudie Chalder etc. They should all be on trial.

    In today's UK Independent newpaprer, Wessely says of the XMRV virus news:

    "And I hope that no one is thinking of prescribing anti-retrovirals on the basis of this," said Simon Wessely, professor of psychological medicine at King's College London. "It's very preliminary and there no evidence to say this is relevant to the vast majority of people in the UK with the condition."

    So here in the UK there will be another massive cover up of biomedical research results led by the self serving psychs.

  3. quilp

    quilp New Member

    Also, have you noticed that whenever research like this comes out these guys NEVER welcome such studies ( and yet they are always calling for more 'research' )

    Never a hint of pleasure that this might lead to a postive resolution for us. 'Very preliminary' Surely it is either preliminary of not ? 'No evidence to say that this is relevant' Well it made it's way into Science one of the most respected medical journals in the world. 'With the condition' oh it's a 'condition' now is it ? I thought it was CFS ? A name which he himself had a hand in naming. He wouldn't be trying to distance himself would he ?

    Take a look at this quote taken from the BBC website :-

    Dr Richard Grunewald, a consultant neurologist at the Sheffield Teaching Hospitals NHS Foundation Trust who is also on the panel that gives advice to NICE on CFS, said he had reservations about the research.

    He said: "The idea that all CFS can be caused by a single virus doesn't sound plausible to most people who work in the field.

    "A lot of the symptoms of CFS are not those of a viral infection."

    Look at that last line very closely. What symptoms are they exactly ? This guy has very close links to Wessely, White et al. And we know who he means when he says 'people who work in the field'.

    We have a real fight on our hands bluebottle, even if this is the smoking gun. Not only are we forced to find that gun, but also produce a receipt stating when and where we purchased it.

    Fortunately we have some very poweful allies, including last years nobel prize winner for medicine. The tide has turned and it seems to me that that smoking gun has been found and reloaded, and it's pointing in the direction of Wessely and his cohorts. Shall you pull the trigger or shall i ?

    Kind regards, Mark
  4. chrissy12

    chrissy12 New Member

    I can hardly read some of the replies from guys like Wessley and This Dr. Grunewald without getting a knot in my stomach.

    The evidence is right in front of them and they still want to pursue their EGOS.....

    Hoping and praying that TRUTH will prevail!!!
  5. gapsych

    gapsych New Member

    Yes, hopefully the truth will prevail.

    I understand everyone's anger including mine if this theory does indeed pan out.

    Hopefully things like wanting these people to suffer or get a bullet are remarks that were written hastily in a moment of passion.

    Hate begets hate as well as wasteing valuable time and energy. While we need to acknowledge this feeling we also need to move on to advocat to find a cure or quality of life with this DD.

    [This Message was Edited on 10/09/2009]
    [This Message was Edited on 10/09/2009]
  6. becc

    becc New Member

    I agree completely, gap. I wish Wessely, Reeves & Co absolutely no harm.

    All I want is a very public apology for their responsibility for the medical neglect of millions of people. I want an apology to each and every family whose mother, father, son, daughter, brother or sister has died directly as a result of, or been driven to suicide by, that neglect.

    Then I want them removed completely from medical research and practice. They mustn't be allowed to pick another group to victimise with psychiatry.
  7. jasminetee

    jasminetee Member

    I agree. I do understand everybody's anger but I think we can state our anger and frustration with people without wishing harm to them. However, I do completely understand why people are doing that.
  8. TigerLilea

    TigerLilea Active Member

    >>>"And I hope that no one is thinking of prescribing anti-retrovirals on the basis of this," said Simon Wessely, professor of psychological medicine at King's College London. "It's very preliminary and there no evidence to say this is relevant to the vast majority of people in the UK with the condition."<<<

    While I dislike Wessely intensely, and believe he does our community much harm, I have to agree with him on this point at the present time. The XMRV theory could very well turn out to be nothing. I've been disappointed too many times so I'm not getting my hopes up! If it turns out that this is the smoking gun we've been looking for, then I'll be the first to celebrate with the rest of you :)
  9. becc

    becc New Member

    I thought Wessely was only in his early 50s? He looks considerably older but he finished his first degree in 1978 which would make him 52 or 53. That's still a long way from retirement.

    The apology would of course be insincere... it would also be the most humiliating thing they could be forced to do. These are not men who admit they are wrong willingly. It would destroy their professional (and quite likely personal) reputations completely and I can't imagine they would be happy about having to apologise to a group of people they have held in such contempt for so long.

    If there is a law under which they can be charged, I'm all for it. Send them to prison. I won't hold my breath, though, as they have been largely doing governments' bidding. But calls for physical harm in revenge for the physical harm they have done to us just reduces us to their level, IMO, and that is something I spend my life trying to avoid.
    [This Message was Edited on 10/09/2009]
  10. AuntTammie

    AuntTammie New Member

    the article that you pointed out also says, " CFS is characterised by cramps, sleeplessness, weakness and headaches." I realize that this is a minor point, but I found it odd....CFS certainly can have these symptoms, but to say it is characterized by them is not really accurate, and seems to once again downplay how bad it is.

    Later it says, " Wessely points out, however, that XMRV fails to account for the wide variety of other factors associated with the CFS, including childhood trauma and other infections such as viral meningitis. 'Any model that is going to be satisfactory has to explain everything, not just little bits,' he says."

    He does just keep on going with his b/s doesn't he? If there were actually real evidence that childhood trauma contributed (which there isn't, considering that the studies on this have been entirely inconclusive; the first one to say this actually failed to compare the results to the rest of the population, and when they did so, they found similar numbers of people with childhood trauma who did not have CFS, ie there was NO difference in correlation between trauma/CFS and trauma/no CFS, not to mention that there are plenty of people who do have CFS who never experienced any childhood trauma)....anyway, even if there were evidence that trauma contributed, it could still be viral - the trauma could just make one more susceptible to getting the virus, instead of being able to fight it off (stress and trauma do make people more likely to getting a lot of other illnesses)

    and something that plays around with the immune system would certainly explain the presence of other infections.....while I absolutely agree that in order for a model to be satisfactory it has to explain everything, he has not really come up with things that XMRV would not explain....not to mention that there have always been suspected to be subsets anyway (obviously subsets would not be completely different and fall outside the causal model entirely, but they could certainly explain some of the other differences).....further the presence of XMRV could start a chain reaction type of thing (which makes a lot of sense given the variety of new symptoms that many of us seem to pick up along the way) so even if a few of the symptoms are not directly caused by the virus, they could indirectly be caused by it
  11. AuntTammie

    AuntTammie New Member

    I struggle with this a lot.....on the one hand, my beliefs as a Christian demand forgiveness, and even my knowledge of psychology says that it is healthier to forgive......oh, and in the Bible it also says that forgiving your enemy "heaps burning coals on his head" (which admittedly is not actually meant quite the way that it sounds)

    but, on the other hand, they have caused so much harm and they continue to try to keep perpetuating their destruction, and for that, I so would love to see some poetic justice
  12. Rafiki

    Rafiki New Member

    this Buddhist says we must bring nonjudgment and compassion to bear.

    Of course, nothing say we can't all LICK 'EM!

  13. QuayMan

    QuayMan Member

    I think the biggest flaw in the two studies the CDC did on this is the fact they used the empirical criteria - 2.54% of the population. They're designed in such a way that a lot of people with depression (but not CFS) can satisfy the criteria (Jason et al found 38% with major depressive disorder got in).

    That's the main flaw. I think with this illness there may be a bias looking back (recall bias). I have analysed my life before getting ill a lot for some reason. And relatively tiny things that happened to me, like a neighbour giving out to me, I can now recall - these are tiny things that I had forgotten about relatively soon after (i.e. I wasn't brooding over them for hours after).

    Perhaps it could be a small factor also but I think the other two factors are likely to explain much more of the issue.
  14. AuntTammie

    AuntTammie New Member

    thanks for your response to what I wrote....and I am so sorry that you had to go thru that as a child, as well as going thru what you are now with this illness

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