Who wrote about carrots/juicer?

Discussion in 'Fibromyalgia Main Forum' started by JimB, Nov 29, 2002.

  1. JimB

    JimB New Member

    I read someone's message a feww weeks ago about how well he was doing after juicing and drinking alot of carrots. I've looked thru 20 pages for that posting and I'm too tired to continue. Can anyone help? JimB
  2. JimB

    JimB New Member

    I read someone's message a feww weeks ago about how well he was doing after juicing and drinking alot of carrots. I've looked thru 20 pages for that posting and I'm too tired to continue. Can anyone help? JimB
  3. amymb74

    amymb74 New Member

    If not, type 'carrot juice' into the search messages box & it will bring up all the posts w/carrot juice in them.


    Survey: Has anyone tried this for combatting fatigue?
    09/22/02 05:54 PM

    Has anyone tried taking carrot juice for combatting fatigue? What were the results?

    Ellice


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    Hippo
    (112)

    Ellice 09/22/02 07:31 PM

    I tried carrot juice and it was a complete waste of time for me. Good luck if you decide to try it.

    Hippo


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    That's strange........ 09/22/02 08:15 PM

    That's strange..........because it is working for me. I've been on carrot juice since April 15, and my energy level has gone up tremendously. Everyone's body, being different, must act differently.

    My experience is that I was not even doing it for fatigue. I was doing it for another reason - to see if I could heal my tooth that needed a root canal. The first time I had carrot/veggie juice, I had energy for two days straight, even up till 2 AM. I hadn't felt that good in almost ten years, and up until then, during the past year, would sleep on lunch break, sleep from 5:30-8:30 PM, and sleep the entire weekend away. Basically, I slept any time I wasn't working, and felt like the living dead at work - felt too tired to be working - just wanted to be in bed. My mistake was not making more juice before that two days was up. I crashed..........badly. To the point where I had to call in and say I had to take a sick day. But I kept on the carrot juice on a daily basis. Many times it was all I could do to stand up and put enough carrots through the juicer to make 8 oz. And then I had to go to bed in order to get enough energy to clean the juicer out. Or I had to go to bed to get enough energy to force myself to make juice. I'm not where I need to be yet, and that's why I went searching for a chronic fatigue forum, but I have a hundred times more energy than I did before. After three years of battling this illness, I have three days a week that I feel completely normal and energetic. I'm really sorry that it didn't work out for you. That's really odd!

    Part of the theory behind carrot juice is that it is alkalinizing. Just like fish, we need a correct Ph level. A terminal cancer case has a Ph of 4.5. The ideal human ph (for saliva) is 7.41.

    I started testing my saliva for Ph level with Ph litmus paper and monitoring the numbers. I also journalled too, so in some time I found that my energy level corresponded EXACTLY to the number. 5.5 was such complete incapacitation it was difficult to even lift my hand to my face, and I could sleep an entire day away. I only have a couple of those 5.5's because obviously if I was too tired to do a thing or move a limb, I could not test my own Ph. Then, 6.0 was incapacitation, but slightly less severe, but not by much. I was able to do the saliva test for 6.0 on my own. Then, 6.2 was the point where I ached all over and was sweepingly exhausted but had enough energy to get up in the morning if I forced myself with all the willpower I had, and it was in this stage that I had to go to work every morning. With AmeriCorps, you get ten sick days, and if you quit partway through the year, you forfeit the educational award of almost five thousand dollars, in addition to losing the monthly stipend. The award is not prorated.

    There were days that I tested at 6.2 when I got up, but the hot bath I took wiped me out so badly that all I could do is stumble to the phone without getting dressed and call my boss and say that I had to take a sick day because I was just too tired - even to get dressed. It was only when I start on carrot juice that I got a taste of anything above that. 6.4 I had a touch of energy, was still a little achy, and still had a hard time peforming under pressure. For the first four months on carrot juice I kept richocheting back and forth between 6.0 and 6.4. I'd have energy one day because of the carrot juice, but as soon as it wore out, I was lucky if I could get up to pee. But, encouraged that 6.4 was possible, I kept trying. And then, in August, I started reaching 6.6's among my 6.4's and 6.2's. Wow. It was like a fog was lifting. I accomplished more during August than in the entire past year. At the end of August, I started to get a few 6.8's among the 6.6's and 6.4's. By that time I knew exactly what color the litmus paper would turn by how I felt, so I only do an actual test once in awhile because my litmus paper is almost gone. Now I have mostly 6.8 and 6.6 days, with a few 6.4 days sprinkled in to make sure that I still can't get a job. I can identify the 6.4 days by the feeling of achiness that comes on me. Today was a 6.4 day. All I got done before I wiped out was picking tomatoes for 2 hours. The other day, a 6.8 day, I was able to pick for 5 hours with only three five minute breaks.

    Maybe this is boring, but this is the science of why I feel 500% better. Not just for you, but for anyone here fighting with fatigue, I offer it as a story of inspiration.

    I figure, if the doctors don't know the answer and they would just tell me it's all in my head, then it's up to me to be my own doctor.

    I still wipe out nearly every day for an hour, but it is less severe, and sometimes I can go two days without wiping out. The goal now? To go three days without a wipeout.

    I also figure that there is a cure to EVERYTHING if only we knew enough. That hope is what keeps me going on the bad days, and fuels the research on the good days.

    There is hope. We have to believe that. :)
    I do hope to keep hearing others' stories about carrot juice.


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    jacibart
    (568)

    that is interesting 09/22/02 09:14 PM

    have you tested the ph after carrot juice?

    Jaci

    ps, try it with an apple & a little lemon juice, also if you add celery at bedtime it is a natural sedative, good for sleep.

    I am going to dig out my juicer tomorrow & dust it off, thank for the technical info, I like to understand why something works.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Thanks, Jaci 09/22/02 09:40 PM

    Yes, I have. Of course, if you test right away, and don't wait two hours after eating or after drinking juice, it tests the Ph level of what you just had.

    There were times I tested Ph ten or fifteen times a day, because I would test after doing something. (The science behind why I started this is because theoretically, if I could raise the Ph to 7.4 where it belonged, the tooth would take care of itself. Six months later, after I needed the root canal, I still have my tooth and can chew on it now, and I have banished the infection and toothaches.)

    It was just fortunate in my healing tooth experiment that I found a lead to energy. Otherwise I would still be feeling like the living dead every single day.

    Yes, lemon tastes wonderful in juice. I wish I had some right now. I put cauliflower in my juice tonight and I should not have. :-( Apple in carrot juice? Serious? That's good? I will have to try it. Thanks for the suggestion.

    A little bit more of what I've learned in the past few months from researching Ph. Higher Ph levels correspond with more oxygen in the body, and with less acid. I think it goes by factors of ten. If not, then a hundred. I would have to research it again. But if it is by factors of ten, 6.4 is ten times more acidic than 7.4, 5.4, a hundred times, and 4.4, a thousand times. A terminal cancer case is in that 4.4 range. Cancer grows where there is little oxygen and lots of acid, but dies with plentiful oxygen. One site claimed that overacidity was the cause of over 150 degenerative diseases, and if one could be at the ideal Ph, that they would be in a state of wellness.

    The Ph paper gives me a way to plan ahead. If I wake up with 6.2, since my Ph only goes down during the day without intervention by carrot juice or a nap, it will go down to 6.0 in a couple hours. If I wake with 6.6, I still need to do something, or in a couple hours I will start feeling achy. It gives me an indicator of what is possible that day. If my saliva can turn that paper green-blue or blue when I get up in the morning and not just light green or yellowish green, I will get some major things done. Either way, what I get out of a day can now be foretold. Being a type of personality who always plans in advance and who used to be able to do 50 items on a TO DO list in one day, I am less frustrated now being able to "see into the future" by testing for those levels.

    Glad you were inspired to dust off your juicer!! Through this journey already, my 87-year-old grandma is now making juice, and so are my parents. It is not the cure-all, but, it helps. If it helps you too, I am glad for a chance to be here and share whatever I can to help you and anyone else here. We are all in this together!! It is nice to be in the company of people who understand!!


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    herblady
    (2110)

    i tried 09/22/02 10:11 PM

    i got a juicer a while back and tried carrot juice but couldn't get past the taste. funny, because i like carrots. if i could find another juice to blend with it that helped the taste, maybe i could use it. but it seems to dominate the taste of every blend i have put it in. cindi


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    The taste of carrot juice............. 09/22/02 10:28 PM

    Yes, that's surprising to hear that. I like the taste of carrot juice.......if the carrots are not bitter, that is. If they are bitter, gag. Although......after five months of this, making juice is starting to wear on me some and I just keep up with it because I have to. Instead of doing it three times a day, I can get away with a time or two a week now. I found some sweeter carrots as my local IGA is carrying a new brand, so I don't always buy bulk from the natural foods store any more.

    Some alterations I've made to the taste of mine was with lemon, or celery, or tomatoes. If you put a lot of tomatoes in it, maybe it would be like V-8 juice. (Mmmmmm.) I can try that tomorrow. My parents grow acres of tomatoes and I can have all the seconds I want of regular and fancy red, purplish, and yellow tomatoes. What I'm not going to be able to get past is tonight's juice. I made the mistake of juicing my cauliflower in it. Gag. Don't do that. :-( Yuck.

    Well, now you've got me thinking! :)


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    klutzo
    (1290)

    DIARREHA! 09/23/02 10:19 AM

    Maybe it's because I already get plenty of betacarotene from my diet and supplements, but when I started juicing carrots, even one cup of the stuff would give me an awful case of the runs. It also turned the palms of my hands orange!
    Klutzo


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Diarrhea 09/23/02 10:53 AM

    Wow. I've been having carrot juice for five months and aren't orange yet.

    The one time I got diarrhea from my juice is when I put alfalfa in it.

    Today I am going to replant my wheatgrass.


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    achy
    (176)

    Why not just eat carrots? 09/23/02 01:50 PM

    Does juicing them do something? I eat carrots like most people eat chips. Love em! But why spemnd all that money on a juicer??

    Warm fuzzies,
    Achy


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    roro
    (250)

    herblady 09/23/02 02:03 PM

    make sure you peel the carrots and cut the ends off. Also put an apple in with it to make it more sweet.


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    tired42long
    (144)

    Carrot top 09/23/02 02:18 PM

    Hi Ellice, I never heard of carrot juice helping with fatigue or any illness really, until I started reading books on environmental illness and other things that seem to deplete the body of vitamins and destroy our natural detoxing sytem (via liver, gall bladder, our digestive system, and even our skin.) One thing that is VERY much discussed in books and publications is the use of juicing hi antioxidants and IMMEDIATLELY consuming this juice, before the natural breakdown of this by sitting. The concentration of the antioxidant value and what you discussed as the oxygen level? in this is what apparently contributes to our health and rebuilding. I have heard alot of what you were saying about our PH and that alkaline digestive "juices" is very beneficial to our health. Most of us with chronic illness are thought to be very acidic. I guess carrot juice, celery, and I think a few other ORGANIC vegetables are thought to be helpful. I think the tomatoes, although healthy for you, may be pretty acidic to add to the juice if you are already acidic. I think I read you can also test your urine for acidity. I also read we are to chew our raw vegetable at least 50 times, that the saliva mixes with and promotes better absorption? I have also read recently and advised by a retired doctor that filtering your water with a higher alkaline will help change an acidic system. I am looking into this now....there are so many units out there. Some with ionizers and ultra violet "beams" or something like that to help with back flow and bacteria build up. I find myself not running, but WALKING through this information. Lots of these health products are very expensive. But carrots, hey, what can they hurt? They are full of betacarotene. They can turn you a bit orange but who cares. My little nephew had this phenomema when he was an infant eating tons of carrots and squash he LOVED. I don't think there are any medical concerns. "Bugs" sure seems healthy so I'm all for it! What's up doc! LOL. eileen


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    The value of juicing as opposed to eating carrots. 09/23/02 02:29 PM

    If I am really into carrots, maybe I could eat five carrots a day. With juicing, I get all the nutrition from five POUNDS minus the bulk.

    Also, it gets around problems with digestion and goes straight for the blood stream. For three years my digestion has been all messed up too. You'd have to do more research, and I will continue doing research too. It doesn't work for everyone, as evidenced by the replies on this forum, but the difference in the way I feel is like the difference between night and day.

    By the way, I did this with a cheapo $39.96 Wal-Mart juicer, not a fancy juicer, although I would have liked a champion juicer because those are good. The wings that hold the top on have since broken, and it won't start without the wings pressing in metal pieces (a safety guard), so I black-taped it together.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Question 09/23/02 02:32 PM

    If they are clean, why is it important to you to peel the carrots? I never do. If I would have had to peel five pounds of juicing them in addition to cutting each end off, I could have never done it. Cutting the ends off was quite enough. In the first few weeks I did it, I could not even clean out the juicer afterward until I had rested for hours. It seems like there would be more vitamins in the skin. I guess I am just biased, because in my family we don't peel very many things.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Apples 09/23/02 02:35 PM

    I'll get some apples from my mom and try that. I thought my juice was sweet because I had good carrots, but hey, if it can be sweeter, I'm all for it!!! Thanks.


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    selma
    (450)

    Ellice 09/23/02 02:37 PM

    Haven't tried it yet.

    ((((((((((((Bumping for others. Great post!)))))))))))))


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    lisa000
    (4)

    Can you just.... 09/23/02 02:57 PM

    Hi! I was wondering if you can buy carrot juice already amde at the grocery and would it have the same benefits???


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Ph litmus paper 09/23/02 04:13 PM

    I am laughing at the thought of the pig poop. But actually, I would wanted to do ANYthing too, if it had a chance at fixing me. I am serious. I felt like the living dead, and not even my best friend understands, and she has no idea how to help. I looked around, and since I'm single, I had to conclude: "I'm it.

    My story is in my first post ever to this site, entitled, "Boy, can I ever relate! But I have found some hope." I ended with the intriguing phrase that I started doing something in April that gave me part of my life back. It was the carrot juice, but I didn't say that in that message, and started this thread for that.

    There are a couple things you could do regarding Ph paper. I went and did a search for Ph litmus paper on the Internet and, much too tired to shop around, settled on some from one site. I'm sure there are better prices. What I got was $14.95, and it had two rolls in it, with two charts. The shipping was atrocious ($7.00) for such a tiny thing, but looking back, I would pay ten and a hundred times that for the value that it gave me. It has lasted a long time - months.

    The other thing you can do, if you don't want to look up Ph litmus paper in search engines (particularly if you are too tired!), I have posted my email address on my profile for the time being so you can email me with a request for the URL. I understand that we are not allowed to give URLS, especially if they are for specific products that people are charging money for. But we can reference a general item. It's up to you. I'm here. :) I wish you all the luck in the world.

    If only you could feel as I do today - energy pulsing through my veins, the ability to go run errands, the ability to do the dishes, the ability to entertain company for a couple hours and make phone calls and deal with financial matters. This is one of the three days a week of energy that I have recovered so far. Imagine - three days a week there is nothing wrong. I was beginning to wonder if it would ever happen. And today, if I make it today without wiping out, it will be a record day.......the first time I have made it three consecutive days without wiping out at a random time. It's true that I never know which three days I will have the energy, but I had none before. So, I am grateful for every small step in the right direction.

    Keep courage. You can do it! You can succeed. As tired and as ill as you feel right now, you are completely capable. I've been where you are at, and although I'm not where I need to be, I can now see hope.

    Set a goal and be specific. By such and such a date I want to be able to______________________________. I've set goals to increase my health by 25% by a certain date, set goals to at least be able to keep up with the dishes (since when the kitchen is messy the whole house seems messy).
    My own goal now is to have no more wipeouts by the time my birthday comes in November. The long term goal is to get the Ph up to 7.4, the ideal human Ph, through raw food, alkalinizing food, juice, whatever it takes. This is my life. I refuse to live the rest of it on the couch and on the Internet. I refuse to keep having to make excuses that I am too tired. I refuse to become disabled.

    This is your life. Refuse to take this any more!!!

    I looked around and........"I'm it." No one else who knows me can help, and the doctors would tell me it was all in my head and tell me, if they acknowledged it, that they haven't a clue how to fix it, and........."here, take all these drugs for the rest of your life so you can deal with the depression that it causes." NO WAY. NO WAY!!!!! This site has given me so much courage to keep up the fight to stay positive and to win this battle.

    After I read up to page 65 on this forum, I realized that even though I came here for understanding, that I have also a duty........to share the journey thus far so that someone may be inspired and come back from the "living dead." I hope that is you.

    Keep in touch and let me know how you are doing. You can DO IT!!!! :) :)

    I have more to share about my methods of how I have survived every day. The next one is called "plus/delta", but this is too long, so I am going to say this is all for the moment.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Ready-made carrot juice? 09/23/02 04:24 PM

    I don't know for sure, to tell you the truth. It would depend on whether it was canned, or if it was bottled fresh. In the town adjacent to this one, I could get freshmade carrot juice at the Breadline Cafe. But canned carrot juice, I have my doubts. From what I have read so far, cooking food makes it acidic. Also, it takes the enzymes out of it that makes it digest properly. That's a topic for me to go do some research on. (I love to research.)

    Now, my dad always tells me it must be drunk right away, because it oxidizes right away. However, I didn't have what it took to make 8 oz. of carrot juice and then spend a lot of time cleaning the juicer. If I was going to bother, I made a bunch and put it in an empty V-8 jug in the fridge, and sipped on it over a couple days, whenever necessary. It prevented wipeouts when I had it on a continual basis. The oxidation issue didn't seem to matter. Not for my purposes, anyway.

    Maybe the best thing would be to do would be to experiment. That initial 20-24 oz. I had, had me bouncing off the walls and feeling completely alive for two entire days up till 2 AM. Also, I must add, for the very first juice, I had put all the produce in the fridge that was going to go to waste if I didn't juice it, into it. That included cucumbers and celery. I added spirulina and salt (it was the Real Salt brand), and even some bee pollen. No matter how nasty it was going to taste, I decided to put everything in the house that was nutritious in it that I could. I was trying to do what's called Energy Soup, in the hope of healing my tooth so I wouldn't have to get a root canal.I wasn't even DOING this for energy. That was a by-product of the healing teeth experiment. Surprise, suprise, it didn't taste nasty. I just made plain carrot juice most every time after that, because I was on a stipend and on a very tight budget - couldn't afford more veggies. But it was working and that was the main thing.

    Okay, I will go do some research on ready-made carrot juice. :)


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Plus/Delta journalling for tracking progress with carrot juice 09/23/02 04:59 PM

    The method that I used alongside carrot juice is called "plus/delta". I had been doing this method since last September, but the carrot juice since this April. It is a neat way of tracking progress. I learned plus/delta from work with AmeriCorps. This is how we evaluated what we were doing for the tutor center and Afterschool program at team meetings, to determine where we were effective, and where we needed to change.

    Instead of plus and minus, it is plus and delta. What is a delta? The Greek symbol for change...........a triangle. So every day I get out a piece of paper, write the date on it, what time I got up and what time I went to bed, my Ph level upon waking and going to bed, what I did for health, AND draw a line down the middle, put a plus sign above the left side, and a triangle above the right side.

    The first five months from September to January, the deltas outweighed the pluses. Irritable bowels, anger, depression, constant crying when I was home, sinus infections and sinusitis, a continual cough, exhaustion, insomnia, achiness, catching the flu continually and having a week or two between each occurrence of the flu, etc. Etc. It was worse than even this. It would take me pages and pages to list all the stuff that was wrong with me. These are just a few examples. Some days I did not even have enough energy after work to write more than the date on the paper before falling asleep on the piece of paper in the binder.

    I took supplements that someone had given me that they didn't want. Most didn't really help, but I could tell that the Super Blue Green Algae did. (However, carrot juice was better, I found out later.)

    Any time I did something different for a health routine, I wrote baseline across the page of the first day that I tried it.


    Sample plus and delta day (the record day on getting pluses):

    8-04-2002

    W: 8:50 (phone call woke me)
    B: 12:09


    Plus:

    Dreams
    Saw hummingbird
    Did not wake up coughing
    Did not wake up sneezing
    Good stool
    Sound sleep
    Ate the garden's first cherry tomato
    Enjoying the flowers
    Excellent avocado!
    Joy hugged me
    Purged paper files today
    Able to bend down weeding for 45 min.
    Found a lot of stuff that I lost
    LOTS OF ENERGY!!!!!
    NO FATIGUE TODAY!!!!!
    Reorganized fridge
    Called 911 to save someone from a drunk driver
    No diarrhea
    The gentle wind
    The rustle of the leaves
    Danced
    Able to walk up the stairs numerous times
    Made carrot juice and cleaned up after it
    Wiped a mess out of the bottom of the fridge
    Singing

    [And on and on it goes. I should not make this too long. But that day I had 77 pluses, and only 7 deltas, - seven things that I would change. So, I've made up a phrase: "Every day has its own pluses and deltas, and tomorrow will be better if I make it so."

    Last year I would have thought a 77 plus day impossible.]

    Delta:

    Snapping/crackling jaw
    Really hard to shift car - UH OH!
    Woke up with runny nose
    Etc. Etc.


    For Health:

    [And then I list the things that I have done For Health]

    24 oz. carrot juice with 3 cloves garlic
    etc.
    etc.

    I now have three binders with pages such as these. When I get discouraged, I go back and look at where I was, and how in the course of September to now, it has changed from very few pluses to mostly pluses and very few deltas. When I have a day where there are mostly deltas, I try to tell myself to cool it, that tomorrow can be better.

    YOU CAN DO IT!!!!!







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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Sofy 09/23/02 05:09 PM

    I forgot to answer the other questions you asked, sorry.
    The Ph paper did not come with instructions, that I remember, but I knew how to use it from the reading on the Internet that I did before I ordered it.

    You need to wait at least two hours after you have had food or juice, so that the test will not come out influenced by that.

    You swallow your saliva and work up more, and do that three times. The point is not to test what's been sitting in your mouth, but to test what your body can produce. Then on an inch of Ph paper you can test your saliva (and I figured out how to use less than an inch to make it last longer). You must have the chart that comes with the paper handy, because the color it turns the paper you must compare to the chart RIGHT AWAY, because the paper keeps darkening. The paper is yellow to begin with, and the chart shows gradations from yellow to blue. If your saliva turns it yellow-green, or doesn't even turn it at all, your Ph is really low. It shows a number for each color gradation on the chart. If it can turn it light green, darker green, bluish-green, you are getting there. If it can turn it blue, then you have a good ph. And there are variations of the blue as well. Each are numbered. The scale goes from 5.0 to 8.5 on mine. The entire Ph scale which is used in science is from 0 to 14. Seven is neutral, and that is what water should be if it is not acidic. Fish need the proper Ph and so do we!!




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    jacibart
    (568)

    juicer vs canned or prepared 09/23/02 08:35 PM

    the benefit of the fresh carrot done & drunk immediately are the live enzymes that are present, that is the whole purpose, the fresher carrots the better, also the reason to peel them is to remove any pesticides in the soil, also the mild that builds up while they are just sitting around waiting to be sold.

    Jaci

    potatoes put thru the juicer make a juice that is great for gravy making instead of flour or corn starch. also add it to soups.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Sounds like good reasons to peel them 09/23/02 08:57 PM

    Sounds like good reasons to peel them.......although it worked for me anyway, I ought to start peeling them. The less pesticide the better.

    I'll try the potato thing.

    Thanks. :)


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    dolsgirl
    (151)

    Ellice 09/23/02 10:41 PM

    That is very interesting regarding the carrot juice. I'm definitely going to give it a try. Hope I'm not allergic to it. dolsgirl


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    chrissy
    (28)

    alkalines 09/23/02 11:07 PM

    hi beautiful you're absolutely right, carrot is an alkaline forming food which means it is acidic.Acid foods reduce body acids. Carbohydrates and fats produceacetic acid and lactic acid. These acids are all poisonous and have to be eliminated as soon as posssible. In our bodies those acids are neutralyzed by mineral compounds. Have you tried Magnesium with malic acid and calcium and Manganese to raise your ph ? . Since carrots are slightly alkaline (around 5.1 or 6) it will take you bags of carrots to achieve the result you could get from ingesting a very alkaline food such as yam, limes,raspberries, watermelons or citrus fruit or mineral compounds. just a suggestion .
    best to you and I am happy you are doing better .


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    herblady
    (2110)

    wanted to mention 09/24/02 12:45 AM

    first off, i tried all that stuff. what i wanted to say is juicing breaks down the cell wall of the produce and makes it more available to the body. cindi


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    I looked up ph paper again on a search engine 09/24/02 07:50 PM

    Sofy,

    I looked up Ph paper again. Some sites refer to it as ph litmus paper, and some just as ph paper. You just have to make sure that you get the kind that is meant for this, and not the kind that is meant for science. The site will tell you if it is meant for testing saliva. I put the words "ph paper" into the search engine Dogpile and came up with some really good sites. Wish I could put them here, but not allowed because they are selling stuff. My email is temporarily in my profile if anyone desires to contact me instead of doing their own search. I did find a cheaper price on the ph paper....my first order of ph paper was $14.95 + 7.00 shipping. This one is even better, for the same identical thing. $10.00 + 4.95 shipping.

    I can really relate to not being able to stay awake. I spent most of last summer asleep. I had to stay with my parents for the summer after getting out of college because my trip to Spain didn't work out. I had said I would help out with the work in exchange for the food and roof over my head. But, in the end, I couldn't even so much as do the dishes, and I slept 12 hours a night, and maybe 5-8 hours during the day some days. They did not understand my fatigue until a couple weeks ago!! I've got it down now to where I only wipe out for an hour every three days (yes, I finally made my record yesterday not to wipe out for three consecutive days), and I can stay awake when company comes and enjoy the visit, as well as having three days a week where nothing is wrong with me and I feel vibrantly alive. The other four I am real tired, but not NEARLY as bad as before, and I feel encouraged that I have redeemed back this much of my life through the study of ph levels and carrot/veggie juice. I can relate to the brain fog and frustration with daily activities and wish you all the luck in the world!!

    You can do it! You are completely capable!

    Ellice



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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Sofy 09/24/02 08:17 PM

    Sofy,

    You can get lists of alkaline and acidic foods off the Internet if you don't do juice. After I had that list, when I went shopping, I used it kind of like a shopping list, and bought what was on the alkaline side.

    My mom got me my juicer once when we were in Wal-Mart. It was one of the few times she was treating me - we don't usually make a fuss over holidays and such. We happened to see a $39.96 juicer and she asked me if I wanted it. Well, since she hardly ever gets me stuff, I said, of course, yes.

    I lugged it to the dorm, used it once there, but for the amount of mess and cleanup, it wasn't worth all that just to make 8 oz. and I had no fridge available for keeping extra juice, or the rest of the carrots. But if only I had known.........I could have rescued my life a year sooner. I would have put a tiny fridge for my room on my credit card had I known I had the answer on sitting on the closet shelf.

    It's a cheapy thing, and the wing parts that hold the top down have since broken off, so I have to black tape them on so that it will start. But, it does the trick and it has given me some life and energy back and the ability to get some things done, for which I am eternally grateful.

    Oh! One interesting thing to do with Ph is if you keep track of it morning and evening like I do, to graph it. Then you see the ups and downs over time, and the trends, if you are getting better or worse. Obviously, it has been just in the last couple months I have felt good enough to analyze stuff like this, because last year when I would start to do the daily health journal, sometimes I would fall asleep on it after writing the date. And it was NOT late at night. More like 5:30 or 6:30 PM.

    Example Ph log that could be graphed to show the trends (improvement or not)

    9-13 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.4
    9-14 AM: 6.4 PM: 6.4
    9-15 AM: 6.4 PM: 6.4
    9-16 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.4
    9-17 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.4
    9-18 AM: 6.8 PM: 6.6
    9-19 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.6
    9-20 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.6
    9-21 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.4
    9-22 AM: 6.6 PM: 6.4
    9-23 AM: 6.8 PM: 6.6
    9-24 AM 6.6 PM: 6.6

    The goal? The ideal human ph (of saliva) is 7.41.
    I try to picture myself vibrantly full of energy, veins pulsing with energy, remembering what it felt like to feel so completely alive. On my 6.6 and 6.8 days, I come close to feeling that way. On the 6.8 days, I can easily accomplish thirty things, some of which I have procrastinated on for months. On the 6.6 days I feel energy and motivation. On the 6.4 days, I feel tired and achy but have some energy but little motivation. 6.2, 6.0, and 5.5 days, that I used to have up till about April this year, were spent entirely in bed or on the couch.

    Anyway, this is long enough. Hope the discovery and study of Ph helps you understand what is going on with you. :)

    Ellice




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    tobynbowmn
    (110)

    I know juicing is so beneficial... 09/24/02 09:12 PM

    Hello Elice,

    Thank you for sharing your great expeirience with Juicing. I bought a juicer 2 years ago and noticed my body did feel better. Although, I haven't seen such a significant improvement as you. I also didn't do it on a regular basis as you. How often did you juice in the beginning?

    My favorite juice is half carrot and half golden delicious apples. I also add a little parsley. Parsley is great for us. If there is anyone who can't tolorate the taste of all carrot, throw some golden delicious apples in there. Yum!

    I bought the juiceman jr. And it held up pretty well til last month when one of the flaps broke. But, I found a way to fix it.

    Also, have you noticed that your nails or hair looking better? I am sure when I get back to doing it (even though I noticed it helps, I just don't do it regularly) it will help with my weight loss and constipation problems. Anyone notice it helping them in those areas?

    Talk to ya soon, after I get some juice in me. Will start again tomorrow!

    Hope you continue to feel better!
    Hugs, Susan



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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Susan 09/24/02 09:28 PM


    Hi Susan,

    At the beginning I had to do it three times a day in order to even go to work. There were times when I couldn't do it because I didn't have enough energy and had to crash and sleep to get the energy to deal with the juicer. Now I do it maybe one or two times a week, whenever I feel a lowered energy start coming.

    When I was just starting on this, but hadn't kept up on it and crashed badly......One of the times I called in sick due to fatigue because I couldn't get dressed after I took a bath, I took a nap in order to get enough energy to force myself to make juice, then I made myself 12 oz. or so and drank that. And every hour or two after that I had at least 8 oz more. By 1 PM I was rarin' to go, and cleaned the entire house. (That had never happened - usually took two weeks to do that!) However, I got too confident, and crashed again that night. In the morning I again couldn't get up to go to work and had to ask my boss for a sick day. I ended up staying home for three days during that crash, and just slept and drank carrot juice, and when I went back to work I felt like I could handle the world. I have carrot juice once or twice a week at this point. Wish I could do more, but finances do not allow it until someone hires me.

    I've got to try putting apples in it. It sounds good. I keep forgetting. Never tried parsley, but will when I have some.

    Yes! My hair and nails did improve. But, the best part? When I got up to a Ph of 6.6, I didn't need to take psyllium to have a stool. I have had irritable bowels for three years.........one time was constipation and the next was diarrhea. There were some weekends I could not leave the house due to this. The natural peristalsis is coming back.....finally! And I am thrilled. And again, in journalling, I found that all or most good days were accompanied with good stools. The foundation of health begins in the colon.

    Hugs to you too,

    Ellice






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    norris2
    (10)

    Fascinating but 09/25/02 08:27 AM

    This is very interesting, and I think monitoring ph is a great idea--anything we can correlate with symptoms. But I still do not understand what is so special about carrot juice. Lots of foods seem to be equally alkaline (poultry, veggies, almonds, flaxseed etc). I love carrot juice but it probably has too much sugar now that I am sick. Could there be something else in carrot juice?

    Norris


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    norris2
    (10)

    Bicarbonate 09/25/02 08:32 AM

    Also, what about bicarbonate...isn't this alkaline?


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Try veggie juice or...... 09/25/02 10:07 AM

    Try other veggies instead, then. Also, wheatgrass and BarleyGreen and things like that have helped others. I just replanted my wheatgrass. The point is to find something that alkalinizes. It doesn't need to be carrots.

    Ellice


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Bicarbonate 09/25/02 10:09 AM

    Bicarbonate.....I have no idea what that is. I'll look it up in a search engine. Whatever is alkaline will get you feeling better.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Re: wheatgrass 09/30/02 09:13 AM

    I grow the wheatgrass in a tray and just use scissors or a knife to cut off what I want. It grows back in few days.

    Sorry I did not get back to you right away. I had a stretch of high energy for four days that was like the energy I had prior to getting the flu on November 12, 1996, and I didn't want to use it up sitting on the computer.

    I have found a high level of fulfillment in the last week helping people find answers to fatigue - based on my own experience with carrot juice and ph levels. This fatigue is more common than we know. Right now I am corresponding with someone and encouraging her and sharing what I know, as well as sharing carrot juice with a friend and with a neighbor for theirs. Now that I have found this site, I no longer have the right to feel sorry for myself that I still have bad days, because I've been victorious enough that there is a light at the end of the tunnel.

    I am going out to the next town today to buy more Olive Leaf Extract. If you look it up on the Internet, it is said to be quite helpful for exterminating those Chronic Fatigue Viruses. It also helped me kick a nasty respiratory problem that I have had since 1996.


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    lilladybug
    (66)

    UPDATE ON ACID/ALKALINE BALANCE! 10/02/02 01:58 PM

    Ellice,

    Wanted to bump this up again....and add that I was in a HORRIBLE relapse and after drinking 20+ oz of fresh carrot juice for a couple of days was up and running again, well not running... but feeling brighter. I have done alot of research on this juicing subject and think you are brilliant to have brought it to the boards attention. It DOES WORK! Not to mention is very healthy and is loaded with live enzymes your body can readily absorb directly into the bloodstream without digestion, to promote a healthier cells and blood.
    (In the whole scheme of things...makes for a better body while ill.)You are one bright lady!

    Also found a good addendum to add with your ph ideas for the body and the ph papers and foods to go along with this theory.

    Thank you LilLadybug


    ACID/ALKALINE BALANCE

    The Textbook of Medical Physiology by Arthur C. Guyton, M.D., probably the most recognized authority on human physiology states: "...the regulation of hydrogen ion concentration (pH or acid/alkaline balance) is one of the most important aspects of homeostasis." (Homostasis is where the components involved seek an equilibrium.)


    DEFINITIONS:
    ph = measure of how acid or how alkaline a substance is.
    ph scale = scale of measurement for acidity and alkalinity.


    acid - 1 alkaline - 7 neutral - 14


    All chemical processes have an ideal pH at which they are most efficient. For example the body functions best with an internal chemistry being slightly alkaline (pH of 7.0 to 8.0). The pH of the blood is even more specific:

    BLOOD ph 7.4 = Normal 7.2 = DEATH



    Our internal body chemistry functions in an alkaline environment. Our blood must maintain a pH of 7.4. If it drops below that to 7.2 we die.

    The cells of the body in health are alkaline. In disease the cell pH is below 7.0. The more acid the cells become, the sicker we are and feel. The cells won't die until their pH gets to about 3.5. Our bodies produce acid as a by-product of normal metabolism. This is the result of our bodies burning or using alkaline to remain alive. Since our bodies do not manufacture alkaline, we must supply the alkaline from an outside source to keep us from becoming acid and dying.

    Food is the means of replenishing the alkaline to the body. The main determining factor of alkaline is the organic minerals. One can equate organic minerals with alkaline for better understanding. Foods are of two types, acid or alkaline. This refers to the ash value of a food. (Meaning the type of residue that remains after the food is digested and processed). Is it acid, or is it alkaline? If there is an acid residue (inorganic acids), the body must neutralize this acid to keep the blood from getting acid. The acid is neutralized with alkaline.

    Ideally there is adequate alkaline in the diet to do this. However, if there is not, the body must extract alkaline from its cells to neutralize the acid. This, of course, causes the cells to become acid, and thus diseased. Because our bodies are an alkaline entity, in order to maintain health, the majority of our diet must consist of alkaline ash foods.

    We can remain in health by consuming a diet that is 70-80% alkaline and 20-30% acid. The more alkaline the better. If we become too alkaline by eating a majority of alkaline foods, we will lose our appetite and automatically want to fast, during which time the normal acid metabolic by-products will return the body' s pH back to normal. It is interesting to note that some foods which qualify as a real food have an acid ash reaction. This is probably nature's way of keeping a balance so that the real food consumer does not become too alkaline. Also note that the acid content of these acid ash real foods is very low and they still contain valuable nutrients which can be utilized by the body.

    On this page is a chart of the acid and alkaline foods:

    ACID/ALKALINE BALANCE

    The breakdown of foods into acid ash and alkaline ash categories would generally be as follows:

    NOTE: Foods in the Acid Ash column are listed in order of least acid to most acid; in the alkaline ash column, foods are listed in order from most alkaline to least alkaline.

    ACID ASH

    SOME RAW FRUITS AND VEGETABLES (cranberries, blueberries, plums, prunes, squash)
    WHOLE GRAINS - COOKED
    OVERCOOKED FRUITS / VEGGIES
    DAIRY PRODUCTS (cheese, eggs, milk, etc)
    SUGAR and REFINED GRAINS
    WHITE MEAT (fish, fowl)
    Raw, Rare, Well Done
    RED MEATS (beef, pork, mutton) Raw, Rare, Well Done
    HERBS, SPICES, CONDIMENTS, SPICY FOODS (garlic, hot peppers, onions, horseradish, etc.)
    FRIED FOOD, COFFEE, TEA, SALT, ALCOHOL
    DRUGS & MEDICATIONS, TOBACCO.


    ALKALINE ASH

    RAW FRUITS
    DRIED FRUITS
    FROZEN FRUITS / VEGGIES
    RAW / LIGHTLY STEAMED FRUITS & VEGGIES
    RAW NUTS (almonds, pecans, cashews, etc.)
    SPROUTED GRAINS


    The average American diet consists of: 20-30% alkaline foods, & the diet should consist of at least: 70-80% ALKALINE FOODS & 20-30% ACID FOODS.

    It is not unusual for the average American to go 7 to 14 days without eating ANY alkaline foods.


    [This Message was Edited on 10/02/2002]

    [This Message was Edited on 10/02/2002]


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Re: UPDATE ON ACID/ALKALINE BALANCE! 10/06/02 01:09 AM

    Lilladybug,

    Thank you so much for finding this information and posting it for others to read! I had read it or something similar to it at the beginning when I first had discovered information about ph levels and did not know where to find it. It is very valuable for the understanding of why we feel bad, and why we get really tired. I know who you are now from our email :) :) but just wanted to say thank you in public too! You can do it! YOU CAN *DO* IT! You are completely capable. Blessings to you today and all who read this.

    Ellice







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    mikie
    (4380)



    Moderator Carrots 10/06/02 10:13 AM

    Carrots are a high starch veggie and consuming a lot of them without the fiber to slow down the digestive system may provoke a large surge of insulin in the body. Long-term juicing with carrots and apples might lead to insulin reisitance.

    Love, Mikie


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    BethM
    (249)

    Thank you, excellent information 10/06/02 04:00 PM

    and scientifically stated, a study of one person's success! Thank you for sharing your data. Definitely has me thinking.
    Peace,
    Beth.


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    lilladybug
    (66)

    Bump for Rain122865 10/07/02 09:23 AM

    Read up!!! Bump bump bump!



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    lilladybug
    (66)

    A Personal Thank you to Ellice 10/07/02 09:30 AM


    Ellice,
    I just finished cleaning the bathroom...top to bottom and took a bath and have been getting my goals and to do list together.....I am flying from the juice today!
    Will slow down now so I do not crash and burn...ph is getting higher!!!! ALL of your info has been SO informative to getting me back on the right track as I had slacked on my juicing at higher quantities, and needed to get my ph up to a living persons level! LOL!
    Just a big thank you for all your support to this community and myself.

    BLESSINGS TO YOU!
    Lilladybug

    You can do it! YOU CAN *DO* IT! You are completely capable.


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    Rain122865
    (32)

    Thank you lililady 10/07/02 09:45 AM

    This is where i got the idea to try the juicer...but..... have no idea on recipes or how many ounces a day to drink or anything else, I have read thru all of the post on here, but I must be missing something? Could someone tell me how much and how often?


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    bethm
    (249)

    sodium bicarbonate is baking soda 10/07/02 11:13 AM

    I read about using it to balance the acid/alkaline balance, especially for those with FMS. I've been experimenting with it. For example, I am at work, started feeling achy and tired, you all know what I mean! I just drank about 8 ounces of water with half a teaspoon of baking soda in it, and within a few minutes I am feeling better, some energy is returning, less fatigued. I am also trying to wean off the Prilosec I've been on way too long, and so far, with the baking soda, have been doing ok, no stomach pain at 3:00 a.m. on the off Prilosec days. (taking it every other day now.) I believe that being on the Prilosec for so long has confused my stomach acid levels to the point where I wonder how much nutrition I am absorbing from any food or supplement.

    I really believe there is something to this theory!

    Peace,
    Beth.


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    lilladybug
    (66)

    message for Rain, Ellice please add on what I have missed! 10/07/02 12:00 PM

    Rain,
    I am not a big eater since I got sick but LOVE to juice. Juicing and juice fasting is considered nutritious...although it is not solid food can contain many more important minerals and vitamins that are easily absorbed into the bloodstream almost immediately in fact.

    There are people who go on 30 -60 day juice fasts....I could never do that because *our* bodies also need substantial nutrients.


    Rain if you will tell me what your main purpose of juicing is I may be able to help you or Ellice too, as she knows alot. If you are trying to cleanse the blood: carrot, beet, beet *tops*,wheatgrass, apple. If you are trying to cleanse and control viruses carrot,wheatgrass,3 cloves of garlic, and arugula. BEWARE OF DETOX!

    There are sooooo many recipes...the best way to figure out is what *YOU* like and for that matter, can tolerate. At the beginning I had a big Chinese herb and veggie book that listed the medicinal properties for all herb and veggies and fruits......I am not Julia Childs and needless to say had a hard time getting ANY of it down it tasted sooo horrible. (And the concoction I had made seemed like it would cure all of my ailments as I had looked up each veggie and corresponded to it....YUCK!)

    I stick to things I would like to eat in their natural form...carrots celery beets beet tops, oranges,apples, etc. Carrot juice is easy to do and I think works best for me,Then add on to it.
    I personally like ginger (ginger root) so I add it to every juice *IF* there's some funky tasting veggie my body needs ...like I do not like the taste of fennel...but ginger can cover it up. Anything with garlic I suggest holding your nose and downing it! Anything green is good the chlorophyll really clears the body and bitter lettuces such as dandelion and arugula help to cleanse the liver at the same time.
    Also I would suggest juice smoothies....carrot juice, apple,orange, and juices of the two too, beet juice and a frozen banana with ginger in the blender for a smoothie treat! Frozen mangoes,papayas and EVEN nuts almonds walnut etc. are great for blender smoothies too.
    Also a great dessert for the afternoon. You should also test for *your* tolerance to sugar and to mixing fruits and veggies....some people who cannot handle the sugar from fruits should dilute it with distilled or oxygenated water, this can help with insulin levels. Also some people believe you should not mix veggies with fruits.....go by what *YOUR* body says.
    Your body temperature can be lowered by juicing so be aware of that.Please do be careful, you can lose alot of weight by juicing ( if you are thin like I am. I lost 25 pounds at the beginning of this illness and that was while I was totally raw (foods veggies and fruits) and juicing. You may wish to eat an organic cracker or some kashi which I find helps my appetite. lettuces such as dandelion and arugula help to cleanse the liver at the same time.

    *FYI* if you soak your carrots overnite (after brushing them clean,cutting off tops and bottoms)in distilled or oxygenated water, they will yield twice the juice!

    Hope this helps!!!

    LLadybug!

    [This Message was Edited on 10/07/2002]


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Re: Insulin Resistance 10/07/02 01:48 PM


    Thanks for the info. I will have to check into that more. (I love researching, so that will be fun!) I never would have thought of carrots as starchy but maybe they are. Usually when I think of starch I think of bread, corn, and peas that went too long before they were picked. Where did you find this information? Is there a site I can go to, to read more about this?

    Even so, I sure am glad I discovered this back in April. I came from hardly being able to get out of bed in the mornings and not being able to get dressed after hot baths to this being my second day of doing recess duty an hour and a half a day and being and feeling completely alive. At the fifth grade girls' request, I did swinging with them. Also, I used the monkey bars while a boy said, "I have to see THIS!" And I explained, "I may be 26 but I like to have fun too!" And I have come home feeling awesome enough to go see the first day of the Afterschool program and volunteer tutoring middle schoolers, even though I am no longer in AmeriCorps doing the Afterschool program as part of my duties.

    As far as fiber, that is also something I have to check into, but consider this: if this is juice not the only thing I am having.............if I am eating three regular meals of fresh fruits and veggies, along with whole grain bread and eggs and cheese, I would think I would be getting enough fiber. More than typical Americans do, anyway. (I grew up with health food as a common topic of discussion and practice in my family.) Then again, I don't know. Also, I have noticed that although at the beginning I started with 20 oz two to three times a day in order to even be able to work, I have now been able to have 20-40 oz a WEEK and be able to maintain a high energy level. It seems that the carrot juice does something permanent in raising the ph level if taken consistently over time. When I reach the ph of 7.4 and can maintain it consistently, I should not need carrot juice at all.

    This is all an experiment, so time will tell. I feel so completely energetic and alive! It's about time! I was just told the other day but someone who doesn't understand that every visit and conversation is about my health. She is one of the two healthiest people I know, despite how I love her, so it is better I get my understanding elsewhere. She couldn't possibly understand what it is like to be sick all the time and to be told it is all in your head or that it is supposedly incurable. She can eat anything! A thought came to me during recess duty with the fifth graders: "Give understanding. Don't expect it. The understanding that's the sweetest is the understanding that comes given freely."

    I have to believe that there is a cure for every disease.
    We humans just aren't smart enough yet.
    Back years ago there was no cure for cancer
    But now people have beat it
    Many through natural means -
    including raw food and/or carrot juice,
    by the way.
    And I am researching all the success stories
    of people who have beat CFS
    because I KNOW and I believe in my heart
    that there is an answer.
    The Universe holds many secrets.
    And I will not stop believing that
    until I have looked under every nook and cranny
    and have made myself completely well enough
    to hold down a full time job again.

    Is there anything else helpful that would do the same
    as carrot juice for me? I have tried many, many, many things
    and so far Super Blue Green Algae and carrot juice were the
    top two that made any difference whatsoever.

    Forgive me for rambling. This is a longer note than is justified by your comments. I am hoping this will be of encouragement to anyone else who reads this, as well.

    Ellice







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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Jacibart 10/07/02 02:28 PM

    Thank you for the tip on apples and lemons in the juice. That tasted very good!!! I have not yet tried the celery as a sedative but I will because as much as I have tried to get my sleep back on track, I am suddenly experiencing a lot of insomnia.

    To get an accurate ph testing you are supposed to test your saliva at least two hours before or after eating or having juice. Otherwise you are testing what you just had. But two hours and longer after having the juice, there is a definite rise in ph!

    Today was my second day of recess duty...I got a job for an hour and a half a day for three different recesses, first, fourth, and fifth grade. I feel completely alive and able to deal with hyper kids and tattletales, kids going the wrong way up the slide, and I am able to run to the scene of someone being hurt when I need to. And being alone with 60 first graders as I will be every weekday for the rest of the year did not even faze me. Not even when one barfed and I had to call for help and then guard the spot because it was a high traffic area. I could not have done this last year, not at all. There's something to juice and ph levels. I just want to share how much it helps!

    Ellice


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    lilladybug
    (66)

    Update to add to the "juicing discussion" 10/08/02 05:05 AM

    ELLICE PLEASE ADD ON YOU ARE THE MOST KNOWLEDGABLE ABOUT THE JUICING PH BALANCE!

    About juicing:
    Hopefully, you if you see any of the results that many of my group of friends see, you will be pleased. Try to drink/juice green stuff too...it helps to clean the body.(wheatgrass,beet tops,celery,spinach,arugula.etc.(NOT A TASTY DRINK!...but so good for your body!) the DETOX is your body "purging" or ridding itself of toxins and old waste. When the body is nutrient deficient...which many of ours are( due to mitochondrial dysfunction)...ie the cell wall can no longer absorb or hold in "good" nutrients the cells can die (and DO) when they are not in a proper PH balance.

    These toxins accumulate in your bloodstream and make you feel slightly cold or fluish...last only a few days. If you drink plenty of fluids along with you juice (oxygenated water or distilled water) the detox is over quickly and 75% of all juicers have no detox effect anyways!
    You will gain your energy back as Ellice (beautifulsimplicity) and I have ...the going may be little slow but as Ellice says "it took your body a while to get here....." just remember to re read Ellices posts on ph.
    Do not forget the ph papers this will be your ultimate guide.
    After getting the papers I see exactly what she is talking about and can combat my fatigue accordingly.

    THE PURPOSE OF JUICING IS ALSO TO GET AS MANY EASILY ASSIMILATED MINERALS AND NUTRIENTS INTO YOUR BODY AS POSSIBLE. REMEMBER, IT WOULD BE IMPOSSIBLE TO SIT DOWN AND EAT 25 POUNDS OF CARROTS AND 2 CUCUMBERS AND 3 STALKS OF CELERY,1/4 OF A BEET,1 APPLE,1 ORANGE AND 1/2 A BAG OF SPINACH IN ONE SITTING!.....WHEN YOU JUICE ALL OF THESE THE 30+ OZ ABOVE - YOU ARE GETTING *ALL* OF THOSE NUTRIENTS IN A FEW GLASSES.
    I COULDNT EAT THAT MANY VEGGIES IN A DAY! AND WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME YOU ATE ANYTHING CLOSE TO THIS IN 2 DAYS? ITS ALL GOOD FOR YOU!

    I try to eat 3 or 4 small meals along with the juicing and 120 oz of water....you can do either.

    Most people find that they need food along with juicing (in theory you do not) I think that being as deficient as our bodies are we should feed it as much healthy food as possible. It is used a a weight loss tool, some people will go 3 days on 4 days off. Or 2 days of each week and 5 days off....My girlfriend did 3 on 4 off and lost 20 pounds in 2 months....but she also ate salads and healthy foods along with her juicing.

    I hate to "recommend" a regime from someone I do not know....so trust your ph levels and your body...listen to your body when it says: "Gosh I want ? and something substantial other than juice" and eat it!

    Bee Pollen is considered nature’s most complete food. Bee Pollen contains more protein than any other natural food, along with the 22 amino acids of the human body.
    Benefits of Bee Pollen:

    - Contains nearly all known nutrients, all 22 amino acids, minerals, vitamins and enzymes.
    - Great energy booster - taken widely by athletes for stamina and for weight control*
    - Natural source of protein*
    - Reduces effects of stress*

    Bee products are associated with benefits to the immune, cardiovascular, endocrine, integumentary, nervous, reproductive, cellular, skeletal, hepatic, and respiratory systems*

    Anti-aging - hormonal stimulant - energy enhancer - natural antidepressant - weight control - cholesterol control - convalescent aids and much more*

    You can find it at your health food store or on the internet.

    As far a taking supplements: I do, along with my juices.
    Just don't overdo...you will get many vitamins with all of the juices. My suggestion is to REALLY research your health...look up your particular problems or complaints and find a veggie or fruit that helps to soothe or ease it ....then juice it! The internet has all of this knowledge and more!


    I have an Omega 8001, but if you are on a budget I suggest a Juiceman Jr...IF you get into juicing as much as I have you will kick yourself later for not getting a bigger juicer, especially if you juice 64oz+ a day!
    You can also find the juicers online....Omega or I think they sell the Juiceman juicers at Target and Wal-Mart.

    Hope this helps!!!

    LilLadybug!

    PS...I try to drink as MUCH juice as I can ....so as far as "How much?" my reply is I don't know!! I started off with 40+
    oz and was chugging it...I know it kept me going through alot of rough patches! Good luck!



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    lilladybug
    (66)

    bump for rain and diggety! 10/08/02 07:30 PM

    bump


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    tobynbowmn
    (110)

    I was wondering the same... 10/11/02 12:27 PM

    i will try juicing to raise my PH levels. However, I was thinking the same. If carrots are considered high in natural sugar .. how are they alkalining the blood? Dosn't sugary foods.. even natural sugars cause acid? If eating a raw carrot or two .. that doesn't alkaline the blood at all cause it's too little?

    Thank you for all the info and well wishes, Elice and others. I hope we get the same benefits as you did.

    Better Health to all.
    Susan


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    norris2
    (10)

    some issues to consider 10/11/02 01:35 PM

    Please read this from Dr. Paul Cheney:

    http://www.immunesupport.com/library/showarticle.cfm/id/3953

    HE claims PWCs are too alkaline.

    I have no doubt some can benefit from juicing but here are some points:

    1) I think it is the nutrition you get from fresh veggies, not ph. Steam distelled water has a higher ph--it should work better.

    2) Yes, it is good that you can get the nutrition from 25 carrots at once, but you also get the sugar from 25 carrots at once, There is not a whole lot of sugar in a carrot, but there are in 25. Problems for insulin resistance and yeast.


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    bethm
    (249)

    Ok, now I'm totally confused 10/11/02 01:53 PM

    are we supposed to get more alkaline or more acidic???? I read the article about oxygen and rebreathing. confusion reigns.

    Peace,
    Beth.


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Re: I was wondering the same 10/11/02 02:50 PM

    Susan, I would think that they would be high in natural sugar, but then again, they are not as sugary as fruits. (I don't think?) I've been thinking about this too and do need to do some research. Will let you if I find anything important.

    The true test, of course, is to actually test your ph with ph litmus paper. Over 6 months, carrot juice has made me way more alkaline. At first I barely had enough alkalinity to turn that paper any color. But now I am heading toward blue. I am corresponding off the boards continually with lilladybug, and she is finding the same benefit from carrot juice and the understanding of ph levels and it is exciting to see her get more energy. I gave carrot juice to a former neighbor with CFS and although she doesn't think much of it, she was up off the couch sorting things, and then doing some remodeling.

    Yes, I can't eat five pounds of carrots, a beet, some celery, etc., per day, but I can get the same nutrition from the juice. I think it reaches the bloodstream directly because it is in juice form. If it were just a sugar high then you would have to take the same amount, or even more, to get the same effect. I went from 20 oz. a day, to now 20 oz. a week. Slowly, the need for carrot juice is declining, and I am able to hold down a part time job doing recess duty for three different recesses now.

    The only really sturdy answer I can give, because I am experimenting too, is................your own body knows. What I know is because I have experimented and researched a lot on the Internet. I wish you luck and great energy! There's light at the end of this tunnel at last!

    Ellice



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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    PWCs and alkalinity 10/11/02 03:02 PM

    I too have read similar articles claiming that CFS patients are too alkaline. Anything is possible. I remain open and do all the reading I can.

    However, overalkalinity is not the case with me, nor the one with CFS that I am corresponding with. We will not be alkaline for awhile, but are in the process of getting there. Alkalosis can cause problems too. I have read, though, that generally when someone is too alkaline their body automatically fasts to return them to that 80/20 balance. We DO need acidic, but only 20%. If we flip the balance, we are in deep trouble.

    The way to tell if you are alkaline or acidic is with ph litmus paper.

    I too have thought of the nutrition angle. I am not an expert. This is all experimentation.

    Good idea about the steam distilled water. I'll do some research and see if it is a resource accessible around here. (very small town)

    Yes, there could be problems with yeast and insulin. That would be a research topic for someone. I am not diabetic, so this has worked for me. I don't know whether or not I have a yeast infection, but evidentally not, because 6 months of carrot juice has almost given me my life back. I am thinking another 3-6 months should do it. Then my friends could look forward to health not being a topic of conversation. (And believe me, they are sick of hearing about it!)

    Carrot juice is not the only alkaline thing. There are many alkaline things.

    Thank you for your concerns. This is all important! I would write a book if I could, after I get up to the ph of 7.4 (from the 5.0 I was at last summer when I slept most of the time and was incapacitated) and it is important to know the times when it doesn't work, or when there are issues. No one thing in the world can be a cure all for everything.
    :)



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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Re: okay, now I am totally confused.......... 10/11/02 03:28 PM

    It's confusing when opposing viewpoints are going around. All I can do is share from my own research and my 6 months of experience in raising my ph from highly acidic to becoming more alkaline. I am not a doctor, nor an expert. I hope to reach 7.0 soon and hope to reach 7.4 (the ideal) in three to six more months. Last summer, when I slept most of the time and couldn't stand up for five minutes to do dishes I was in the lower 5 range. Despite what information I or anyone else shares, you should compare and research, and not take anyone person. Trust your heart and your body.

    The majority of the information circulating on the Internet says that our ph level, in order to be perfect, needs to be at 7.4. I know that there are some reports circulating that people with CFS are too alkaline, but that is the not the case for anyone I know. The surest way to find out is to test your saliva using ph litmus paper. So far the only person who was blue on the paper was an eight year old children. (The paper on the acidic side is yellow, yellow-green, green-blue, and the alkaline side is blue, then more blue, and more blue.)

    On the ph scale, of 1 to 14, seven is neutral, neither acidic nor alkaline.



    7.4 happens to be slightly alkaline. If you are too much above the ideal 7.4, you will be in a condition called alkalosis. This can cause just as many problems.
    Below a neutral ph, when you are into the 6's, you are in the process of developing many degenerative diseases, including CFS/CFIDS, cancer, massive tooth decay, and many, many more.
    And in the 5 range, you may feel like you are scarcely getting by.......if your experience is like mine and that of a friend from these boards.
    The ph level of a terminal cancer patient is often around 4.8. Carrot juice can heal cancer (I've known this for many years). Now I know why. It raises the ph level.

    According to the reading I've done, vitamins and minerals assimilate far less at lower (more acidic) ph ranges. Some, like iodine, have to have nearly a perfect ph in order to assimilate. Others can assimilate even with the ph off a little.

    Each of these numbers of ph are exponential by a factor of ten, so if you are at 6.4 instead of 7.4, you are far more acidic than it may at first appear.

    6.4 is ten times more acidic than 7.4
    5.4 is ten times more acidic than 6.4
    so it is 100 times more acidic than 7.4


    4.4 5.4 6.4 7.4
    10 x 10 x 10 Ideal

    All of this was about SALIVA ph level, which mirrors the intercellular fluids of the body. There are different ph levels of different things in the body. You will know more about this later if you choose to look up ph levels/acidity/alkalinity on search engines.


    You mentioned oxygen. I have noticed that many of the things that are beneficial to CFS have something in common. They involve oxygen being more available to the cell. There are a number of things I am trying to increase cellular oxygen levels. I want to know more about cellular biology. I theorize that what would help one cell might help them all. So far, I know that the mitochondria is the powerhouse of the cell, and is involved in production of adenosine triphosphate (ATP) which is what is produced from food to give us energy. Evidentally, we don't get our energy directly from food. A lack of oxygen might impair the process to make ATP. I am in the middle of researching this.

    When the body is too acidic, the tissue is anaerobic, or oxygen-deprived. According to the research I have done thus far, this is the setup for disease and fatigue. Cancer cells, too love anaerobic, highly acidic environments.

    A friend and I are both doing carrot juice and study of ph levels. In fact, I met her here on these boards. All I can say, is what we are doing is helping tremendously. I wish you luck, and much energy!

    Trust your heart.
    Your body knows.

    Ellice













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    tobynbowmn
    (110)

    Bump for Sean 10/12/02 05:51 PM

    Hope the post you were asking about is in this thread..


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    paulmark
    (263)

    Survey: Has anyone tried this for combatting fatigue 10/12/02 06:19 PM

    beautifulsimp: i don't guess we've met i'm practically bedridden 5-6 hrs. in afternoon with cfs/fms main dx is cfids by dr. cheney, working with a naturpath nutrition.
    over ph. and e mail i'm in ky he's in ca he's had me ck. urine and sal. ph 2 hrs. after eat and e mail i ver very alkaline, which is why he says i have alkaline reflux, which translates to dr. cheney's hypoachlorida, low stomach acid in many cfids pat.

    my own person opinoin is that the fatigue depending upon how sick one is with cfids fms and what i've learned from cheney, drives the ph's out of whack, he warned that remember now PH is compartmentalize in the body cells can be either too alk or acid and gut same or vice versa

    i think the ill. and fatigue have a lot to do with although no doubt the diet is important, if i drink striaght carrot juice my tongue and mouth break out yeast? who really knows the answers bu the good Lord is my opoinon

    if i dink carrot apple same thing happens so the macrobiotic nutritiois that came and stayed and cooked for me a yr. ago my dad pd. them, kept saying too acidic but this nat. nut . says to alkaline, so who in the heck do you believe,

    i really think the cfs # 1 issues drive the fatigue HPA axis suppressin low growth hormone, although everyone ill. is different, and of course lack of that level 4 sleep

    PM in KY


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    norris2
    (10)

    Sometimes forget the science and do what works 10/13/02 08:03 AM

    Although I am not real sure about beautifulsimplicity's theory why carrot juice works, I do agree with several points made:

    1) Experiment and research, measure your temp, blood pressure, ph (thanks for the idea), take cold bath one day a warm one the next etc. etc. Correlate with activities, food, symptoms.

    2) If it works for you--then do it and buck all the conventional wisdom! You don't always have to know why it works--even the doctors and biochemists usually don't. There is no 'one' CFIDS--we are all disordered in different ways--so I appreciate this post.




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    lilladybug
    (66)

    PH papers ARE the crystal ball!!! 10/15/02 08:26 PM

    Ellice just to keep you posted...you are right the ph papers can tell you how what and when you can do what and when to hit the juice!!! It is fantastic!!!
    I bought the papers from the site and have been slowly but surely going up have come up from 5.0 to 6.2 today!!!!Have even made a 6.4!!!! Was able to do so much....am really glad that you have been there for me to support me getting back on track!!!
    Wanted to publicly thank you......today I was able to get fully dressed walk down 3 flights of stairs and go to my doctors appt without much problem....also to mention too....I was/have been bedridden for many months since February and am slowing climbing back up!!!I do have ups and downs but am feeling much better....thank you for the jump start and the ph papers!
    I have always known about the benefits of juicing but being able to gage yourself with the ph papers...its a miracle
    YOU are SO ONTO SOMETHING!!!!

    To those who say they cannot juice carrots there are soooo many other veggies to juice....just check the acid/alkaline lists.....greens and leafy things are the best for those with
    yeasts and insulin intolerance....or you can "cut" the veggie/fruit juices with distilled water....

    Norris2 agree with you on the last 2 points but have to agree with Ellice on the carrot juice for myself....but if you read the above posts I also juice other veggies that correspond to MY specific problems:

    1) Experiment and research, measure your temp, blood pressure, ph (thanks for the idea), take cold bath one day a warm one the next etc. etc. Correlate with activities, food, symptoms.

    2) If it works for you--then do it and buck all the conventional wisdom! You don't always have to know why it works--even the doctors and biochemists usually don't. There is no 'one' CFIDS--we are all disordered in different ways--so I appreciate this post.

    As Ellice says Trust your heart. Your body knows.

    By the WAY....Congrats Ellice on your 7.0 for 3 days!!!!
    AMAZING girl!!!! You make me want to keep up with you!!!

    I CANNOT THANK YOU ENOUGH!





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    lilladybug
    (66)

    bump 10/24/02 10:05 AM

    bump bump for ellice!


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    beautifulsimplicity
    (105)

    Bump 10/25/02 01:48 AM

    Bump


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