Hitting a plateau with TF, CFS no better | ProHealth Fibromyalgia, ME/CFS and Lyme Disease Forums

Hitting a plateau with TF, CFS no better

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New Member
I have Epstein-Barr virus and Cytomegalo virus. My D.O. put me on TF. I've been using TF System 100 and initially even 1 cap was too much. Bad herxing. I slowly built up to 2 caps/day, but after 7 months, I don't feel like I'm improving.

Do I take more?

I was only tested for 2 viruses, but now out of work and insurance. Any other recommendations?


I am not surprised that you have plateaued. Personally, I have not heard of anyone getting well with TF's but feeling alot better.

You have a couple of choices that I see.

1. Start pulsing the TF to see if the pathogens have become accustomed to it. Pulsing drives them crazy and stirs them up and may kill more of them.

Mikie can get good results with taking two capsules every 6 weeks. I can't. We have come to TF's through very different journeys. Mine is like Rich Carson's ...kutapressin for years, then Immune Transfer C and then he added Mycoplus. Which I have now added.

Mikie went with more tradional antivirals and ABX and she uses a zapper.

So, you could do like Mikie or try a different pulse. Right now I pulse Mycoplus by taking it for 3 days a week. Then I take the Immune C for 4 days. I have to admit that I just tinker with stuff. I have since I got this DD 20 years ago.

Oh yes,

2. Olive Leaf Extract. One big name doc tells his patients to take it with TF. The kind here at this site is $10 for a bottle so it is cheap!!

This stuff makes me ache in all the places the Marshall Protocol did. I feel like it is doing something good. But since it is the holidays, I am not taking it again til January.

This week I have had the two best mornings in 20 years. I felt normal. That is the truth.

So....hope this helps,


PS. Nevermind the Olive Leaf since I read your Bio and you already take it. I have another suggestion but I will do a different reply.
[This Message was Edited on 12/10/2006]


I find that I do not get the post exertional fatigue so much anymore.

BUT, my body has to be pushed to the next level of exercise in a way that normals don't have to do. (Now, this is just me)

When I started walking, I could only do 15 mins, then 30. At 30 I had to eat something and then so 15 more. That only happened that one time. Now I can walk 45-1hour and not eat at all.

Then I started the exercise classes at the Y. First, I could do a yoga, the two. Then I added a Pump it Up classs. It is so hard for awhile I only went for the warm up (this dd has really humbled me). Now I can do two classes of it a week. I have added a line dancing class but have stopped for the holidays. Hmm...where those the two morning that I felt normal. I think so! Wow.

The thing I have noticed about the Pump it Up class. Is that after the warm up, we do squats, then we lie on our backs and do something with our arms, then we stand and do "knees and squeese and deadlifts, then we lie on our backs and do other arms things. Last we do the horrible lunges. I think it is the alternating standing and lying down that helps alot. (I wrote that for if you want to try something like that at home...we use body bars).

That is all I have....



New Member
I exercise whenever I can. When its cold outside, I get sick fast. I rest as soon as I get tired. My heart has these weird feelings, but two cardiologists can't find anything wrong. Everything is OK with my heart when I exercise, but when I rest, it feels like its going to quit!

I do take Olive Leaf, ALA, C (1 ~2 grams/day).

I'll look into the MycoPlus and other stuff [now I can't see your post] My wife isn't working right now either, so she will flip out if I purchase the expensive TF.

I sometimes wonder if I'm getting better with the TF or if the viruses are staying at the same level. I was also reading that its the cytokines given off by the viruses that make us "feel" sick. So maybe I am getting better but just need to be patient.


You get sick when you exercise...sound like something viral, bacteria or myco going on...maybe.

I can understand about the high cost of the TF's. If my spouse had any idea how much I spend...to the moon! lol. After he got over the shock, he would be happy that I am doing better. I had some very rough years.

I wanted to tell you that my heart was acting strangely for two years before a doc would put me on a calcium based channel blocker. Isoptin 240SR is what I take but there are many more out there. Dr. David Bell on the home page a few weeks (months?) back recommended that FM patients take a calcium based channel blocker. His was for the Orthostatic Hypotenion. I have to tell you that sounds to me like CFS not FM.

Also, Dr. Cheney says CFS has big time heart involvement.

Something to consider.



When you tackle the viruses, the heart stuff goes away. Have you tried Nexavir? I've had some positive responses in the 2 weeks on low dose. I'm going for the full dose now.



No, I have not tried Nexavir as yet. I have just watched Dr. Cheney's two dvd's on "The Heart of the Matter". It was filmed in 2004 and is sold by the Dallas/Ft. Worth CFIDS Support Group.

Marc Iverson bought Dr. Cheney alot of expensive heart equipment so that he can document what happens to most of the CFS patients (not all).

First Cheney showed the heart not functioning properly, then he used magnesium and with in 3 minutes the heart had energy to function better but only lasted a few minutes so so.

Then, he used the Nexavir gel and got the same results but lasts 8 hours (so Cheney says). Very interesting.

It is quite an expensive protocol that Cheney uses.

I was just thinking, particularly when I use Mycoplus, I can exercise more and my heart feels better. Immune Transfer C does a good bit but not like Mycoplus. I wonder if it is working in the body something like Nexavir. I know it is not an antiviral, it is anti mycosplasms. Just thinking out loud.



New Member
Looks like Nexavir is a "liver derivative". I'll keep researching. I've never tried it. It's prescription and I'm out of work for right now. Too "lazy" to work yet.

I started this thread in December! Since then, I've found that my heart problems are related to metal toxicity and sugar flaring viruses. If I eat sweets, it flares up and my heart feels bad. I get tinnitis too.

I just started Round 11 of DMSA chelation. My heart is feeling better during the rest cycles.


You are going to be over your laziness and malingering before I am!!

Check my post on the other messageboard about Nexaver/kutapressin/transfer factors and the heart. I am too tired to copy it here.



Even if we can get the pathogens under control, or erradicate them, we will not be cured. There seems to be something larger than just chronic infections afoot with our conditions. On the other hand, I do not believe we can achieve healing and make progress if we do not address the infections.

I also believe that dealing with the hypercoagulation, which usually accompanies chronic infection, is necessary to our healing.

Finally, it seems that we can help our own immune systems to improved while we treat our infections. I use probiotics, colostrum, and undenatured whey.

The rest is getting good rest, reducing stress, and eating well.

As Spacee mentioned, I have used a combination of traditional medicine and alternatives, like the TF's and zapper. When I started out more than six years ago, not much was known about any of this and it certainly wasn't being practiced by most docs. I learned of everything I've used here and then done my own research before presenting treatment options to my docs.

I'm a lot better than I was six years ago but the progress has been agonizingly slow. There have been some setbacks, such as my being sick with a nonfunctioning gallbladder most of 2006 before it was diagnosed and removed. That, however, could happen to a well person. Only difference is that it takes us longer to recouperate from these things.

I'm getting ready to try to work a couple of days a week here pretty soon. If I can do that, I will consider myself on the right road. If not, I still can have a fulfilling life. I do expect the progress to continue; I just don't know how much better I can get. Also, I've been sick a long time so normal aging may mean that I'll never get back to 100 percent of where I was before I embarked on this trip to healing. I know that if I had done nothing, I'd still be bedridden most of the time and likely still on Morphine, or some other opiod, at a higher dose. I'll take what I can get.

In the meantime, I continue to try to keep abreast of the latest in treatments and pray for a cure. I visualize myself as a healthy person now so that it can become a self-fulfilled prophesy. I also remain grateful and a new mantra for me is, "Thank you for my healing."

Love, Mikie


New Member
Yes, Dr. William Wong discusses hypercoagulation due to fibrin (a blood clotting protien) that will dissolve when our systemic enzymes are up to par. Taking Systemic enzymes like Vitalzym or Virastop helps to dissolve those Fibrin blockages. Lack of blood flow causes ischemic pain.

Getting to the Root Cause of a compromised Immune System involves lots of trials and effort. I'm thankful that I found mine to be high levels of Lead. With each round of chelation, I feel a little better.

I was just reading about Antimony, that it can cause heart EKG problems.

Cadmium interferes with the thyroid hormone T4->T3 conversion.


New Member
I'm new to this site and people like spacee and allwxrider seem to know so much. There seem to be so many protocols out there and its hard to know where to start. My wife, and two daughters have CFS. We live in New Zealand and at times like this it feels a little like 3rd world. My wife started with candidiasis during her fourth pregnancy 10 years ago. Last year she had a full hysterectamy because of endometriosis. Over the years we have tired things like Barly grass, probiotics (still), very limited diet (still), colostrum, armour thyroid, bioidentity progesterome cream. We are just starting vitamins, minerals, 4life transfer factors. Also thinking of feeding the mitochondria system. There are so many differnt approaches it is hard to know whereto start.


New Member
Check for heavy metal toxicity. Here in the USA, www.bodybalance.com is good but not sure where is convenient in NZ.

The fact that your whole family has CFS is an important clue.
Dr. Jacob Teitelbaum has a list of things that help at his website at endfatigue. I'm trying ProBoost.

I'm also trying a new product called EpiCor, deriviative of Brewer's Yeast...hey...I always thought that beer was good for you!


New Member
My wife got it during pregnancy (hormones/immune). Two of my girls got it starting with a virus when young (hence the interest in TFs). The older one (now 14) got significantly worse at puberty (hormones?). The younger one (now 11) is now getting worse (hormones again). There is me and two other daughters who are clear. I think I will explore these two paths (also feeding the mitochondria).



New Member
One exciting product is D-ribose. Its a sugar that feeds the mitochondria directly without being processed by the liver. Dr. Teitelbaum says the key is to take 5 grams doses 3X daily for starters. 2X daily for maintenance.

Ribose is a pentose sugar that doesn't feed fermentation ie. yeast and doesn't need insulin to feed the cells. It has a negative glycemic index! Its cold and heat stable too.

Dr. T says it take 3 days to 3 weeks to work. It took 2 weeks for me. I ran out...so I've stopped using it.